Abducted Child

[SuzySunshine]

So if you have been on fb in the last 24 hours you probably saw the Amber Alert that was issued in the KS/MO/OK area for a 10 year old girl that was abducted while walking to a friends' house yesterday afternoon. Her body was found and the man has been arrested. So here is my question - at what age and what do you tell your kids? Not necessarily about her story because they didn't know her but to keep them safe.

We live in what I believe to be a safe neighborhood however I have been concerned before about the amount of work man that in our neighborhood on a regular basis - we have a lot of elderly people on our street and a lot of them have landscapers, lawn people, construction people, etc. A "work style" van could drive down our street and not even get a 2nd glance, we're pretty sure when our ladder was stolen out our backyard last year it was done in the daylight.

At the same time there are ALWAYS kids playing on our street, granted mine are the youngest and the rest are in the 8-10 year range.

I also read a statement a few days ago that made me wonder if my kids' attachment to me isn't strong enough.

indiscriminate affection. Another American lady came to the house where we are staying to let her dog play with the homeowner's dog and within a few minutes [she] was trying to hold her hand and gesturing for the lady to pick her up. I didn't even know the lady and [she] certainly didn't know her. This is a classic behavior with children who have attachment issues. This sweet little girl has been passed from person to person for so long. As strange as it may seem, it is not a healthy thing when adopted children act very outgoing and affectionate with strangers. It is called "indiscriminate affection" and can mean that they haven't really attached to anyone.

I know we love our kids and I know our kids love us but A does this ALL. THE. TIME. She is constantly talking to people she doesn't know when I am there, she is constantly hanging on her friends' parents when we see them at sporting events, etc. I worry she could be the little abducted girl because she is SO friendly and people say - oh she's so outgoing, we just love her spirit, etc. but it scares me....

[Thirteen]

Your question is good, but very very tough.

I remember listening to a children's sing a long tape as a child, that talked about strangers. Granted, it had all kinds of songs about things like: personal hygiene, memorizing your address and telephone number, manners, etc.
Anyway, the song about strangers had lyrics that said: "Sometimes you've just got to yell and scream, sometimes it's the only thing to do, noisy as a fire truck, you just have to open up and get the crowd's attention turned to you." The premise was, if someone you didn't know approached you and offered you something promising, or tried to take you, you needed to scream and yell (preferably something like "This isn't my Daddy" or "I don't know this person!")

It also talked about people who, if lost, were okay to approach: policemen, firemen, people with name tags and uniforms on in stores, etc.

I never misused that information during a tantrum or fit, because it was drilled into us how serious saying and doing those things were.

That said, and I will be brief, it did not prevent me from being molested by a family friend at age 10. It did, however, help me tell the adults in my life immediately and I was taken incredibly seriously. I don't say all that to scare anyone, but I believe open communication between parents and children about strangers and even people you know (what's appropriate and what isn't) should start at a very early age.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SoonerTexan]

That is horrifying.

I don't know what to say about your attachment question, but that sounds more like common behavior for her age more than anything.

[Deebs]

I've heard many speak about inappropriate affection and attachment issues. I've also heard the opposite - kids who are hugged a lot and see hugging are more likely to hug. My kids are VERY attached to me, and yet, they hug - everyone. I hug everyone. We hug our dentist, our doctor, the neighbors. We live in a scary world, and my husband has a job where he gets to tell parents their child just died, tell children their parent has died, and changes peoples lives in an instant. Life is too short not to spread love around the world. I watch my children carefully, and I will teach them to hug and love. I'm not going to stop. I also teach them to trust the little voice inside that tells them not to trust someone, not to hug someone, and I watch them. That's the best I can do.

[GrayMatterWife]

1. We have told our children, from a very young age, that there are bad people in the world who do bad things to children and even to grown-ups. We lived most of our years with kids in St Louis, in the city proper, and there was a lot of crime and a lot of weirdos.

2. About A's super-outgoing personality: I have no idea if there is an attachment issue (although, my completely amateur, layperson, no-nothing opinion is, she has no attachment problems--I've seen you guys together and she seem clearly and appropriately attached). However, in terms of how her personality might "impact" her likelihood of being an abduction victim: it may cut two ways. If you teach her to scream and kick and cry "fire, fire!" or "murder, murder!" (NOT "help, help!"--no one listens to a kid playing outdoors who yells "help!"), she may be more likely to do it, if she is not shy. And the last kid anyone wants to kidnap is the one who brings attention to herself. On the other hand, she may be so much more inclined to approach a stranger that she could end up in trouble much faster than she could think to fight back--especially if her initial contact with the guy is good.

I would consider getting some age-appropriate "stranger danger" type videos or books and going over the material with her. But, that being said, the vast majority of victimized children are hurt by people they know. I would be cautious about "compartmentalizing" the expectation of a "bad guy" and giving her the impression that "bad guys" are limited to people you don't know.

[MrsK]

I've been introducing this in stages. For instance, K1 knows that if he is lost he needs to find another mommy with kids and ask her to help. The pediatrician has talked to him about not letting people touch his private parts. DrK has talked to both of our boys about inappropriate touching, not touching each other inappropriately. The boys are learning about community helpers in school. These topics come up organically and are discussed in very small doses. It's an on going discussion.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 4

[Deebs]

We have similar discussions to the K family. When we arrive at a public place, I actually quiz the kids. "What will you do if you lose me?" Kids who are taught not to talk to strangers have a problem in such a scenario - they NEED to talk to strangers, but be able to identify "safer" strangers. A mom, with kids, is their best bet. I actually teach my kids not to go with police officers they don't know unless they are in a marked car and there is more than one of them. We quiz them at the mall on security guards and security vehicles. Those are not police officers. Badges can be easily obtained, so that kind of identification can really confuse kids.

As a funny aside - last summer, my kids watched a "Today Show" segment with me on kids lured into an ice cream truck. It spawned some awesome discussion. The next time our ice cream truck came by, DS said to the driver, "I will never get in that truck with you, even if you promise me free ice cream!"

I don't know if I've mentioned it before, but "The Gift of Fear" is an awesome book and has really helped be okay teaching my children they don't have to hug/shake hands/engage with anyone who they get a strange feeling about. Everyone needs to learn to listen to their gut and it is okay to be rude, in some cases. So, I guess I don't really let them hug everyone.

[metroguy]

the problem with living in a world of fear--is you'll grow up paranoid(that's me-- i raise this way). i'm not sure if that's the best way to raise a kid.. if someone wants to kidnap or harm your child--chance are high, he/she will do it-whether you're cautious or not. now the question becomes-- will he/she pick an easier target if your child is cautious? maybe/maybe not-- i think that depends on the weirdo. of course, it doesn't mean you should let your kids become easy targets. i'm in nyc, and i prefer to always have eye contact with my kids ever where i go. of course, i lost eye contact for a minute or so--i can tell you, that's terrify.

[spotty_dog]

the problem with living in a world of fear--is you'll grow up paranoid(that's me-- i raise this way). i'm not sure if that's the best way to raise a kid.. if someone wants to kidnap or harm your child--chance are high, he/she will do it-whether you're cautious or not. now the question becomes-- will he/she pick an easier target if your child is cautious? maybe/maybe not-- i think that depends on the weirdo. of course, it doesn't mean you should let your kids become easy targets. i'm in nyc, and i prefer to always have eye contact with my kids ever where i go. of course, i lost eye contact for a minute or so--i can tell you, that's terrify.

Yes, I believe that we've been a bit overexposed to the bad things in life, thanks to vigilant media being quick to tell us ALL about the awful things. It's not *so* scary out there. But kids do need to learn it's not all sunshine either. In karate, our sensei teaches "Avoid dangerous places, and a dangerous place is anywhere that your parents don't know where you are." Riding bikes to the ice cream store after telling mom? Not dangerous. Getting in someone's car on a whim? Dangerous. Sensei also teaches kids some warning signs, such as the fact that grown-ups don't usually ask kids for help. If a person at the park asks you to help find his puppy, the correct response is "Okay, I'll go get my mom." Because an adult can help better, so if they are honest you are being helpful and if they are dishonest you are being safe.

It's definitely an ongoing, age-appropriate conversation.

[Vanquisher]

I had very few discussions with my kids about this. I don't want them to live in fear. We've talked about bad people and how you can't tell who is bad by how they look or if you know them. We've talked about not getting in the car with anyone with my permission. Hasn't stopped Lexi on at least 2-3 occasions when she's done it anyway. Each time we've talked about NOT doing that, but I don't want to go overboard. Honestly, stranger abductions are so rare, I'm not really worried.

[peggyfromwastate]

I'm more worried about this with my older kids. The younger ones know that they need to ask a mom with kids for help and that I will never ever tell a stranger to pick them up. I say also that I won't have them go anywhere with someone they know unless I've told them that morning, and told the teachers etc. My kids have seen me freak out when one of them is lost enough to be scared.

As far as the older ones--- they know that sometimes a kidnapper might use force or threats vs trying to lure. So, I tell them to scream and fight. If they say they will hurt me, or someone else in the family, if they don't go with the stranger-- I tell them to ignore this and just fight. My daughter is in tae Kwon do this year to learn some blocks and self defense techniques, but really-- the best thing she could do is scratch eyeballs and grab the trachea and kick and scream.

Anyhooo, my kids aren't scared, but we have had conversations as they come up.

Our tae Kwon do master also makes a point of telling the kids that they should never go with anyone at all if they don't have permission from their mom. Then he says-- "what about me? What if I drive up to you and say, 'hey let's go get ice cream!' Would you come with me?" Invariably the kids will say "yes!" And he has to say--- "nooooo. You need to call your mom and dad first. You might know me a little but but you always need to have permission". He also requires kids as young as 3 to know their parents' phone numbers, and home address. And the kids learn it too. He says that way they can call their parents and ask directly for permission.

It's scary to think about... But we don't dwell so that we don't stay stuck living in fear.

[Sheherezade]

Me too on the older kids. A friend is writing a book on child safety and yesterday she was posting abduction stats. By FAR, the largest group subject to stranger abduction was 15 years and older teen girls. You know what that's about. This is a sad world sometimes. I'm also putting my daughter in self defense classes and teaching her not to worry about offending someone by making the wrong assumptions and avoiding them or not being "nice".


Angie

[scrub-jay]

I also read a statement a few days ago that made me wonder if my kids' attachment to me isn't strong enough.

I know we love our kids and I know our kids love us but A does this ALL. THE. TIME. She is constantly talking to people she doesn't know when I am there, she is constantly hanging on her friends' parents when we see them at sporting events, etc. I worry she could be the little abducted girl because she is SO friendly and people say - oh she's so outgoing, we just love her spirit, etc. but it scares me....

FWIW, A is very friendly and talkative, but she does not have indiscriminate affection IMHO. I used to teach swim lessons to a group focused on kids who were in the foster system and some of those kids definitely seemed to have indiscriminate affection issues. It was heartbreaking at times because some of them were just desperate for any attention (positive, negative, didn't matter) due to previous neglect or worse.

[houseelf]

When I think of overly-effusive kids who probably are not properly attached, I think of my friends' three foster kids. The two oldest girls, 4 and 3, ask if they can come home with me or whichever adult shows a whit of attention. They are so insecure about their future of care that they will jump on anything that will be a good deal. To extrapolate that any socially gregarious, confident kid has attachment issues is a bit of a stretch for me.