The Santa Thing - Heidi

Just out of curiousity -- NOT trying to start a debate or anything...

What is it you don't like about Santa / why don't you do it with your kids? I know you're an athiest - but to me Santa is the most innocuous non-Christian part of Christmas, so I'm curious as to why you don't dig him. Is it the stranger coming into your house while you're sleeping aspect? Or the putting your kids on a strange man's lap aspect? Wait a minute ....

I don't do the angel / nativity part of Christmas - my Christmas is wholly tradition-based and no religion. But we're big on Santa here (although I didn't take my kids to see him this year). Santa, snowmen and Christmas trees are the bulk of our Christmas.

Again -- totally a curiousity thing - if you don't want to answer, that's okay too.

[Vanquisher]

No, I'm totally fine with answering, as long as no one gets offended by my answer. :>

I don't lie to my kids. I think Santa is a huge gigantic lie, and I hate it. When your kids get older, it's lie on top of lie. I don't like the religious tie-in with Santa Claus. The fact that Santa can see when your sleeping, knows when your awake, knows if you have been bad or good, etc. I don't like the omnicient aspect of Santa. It's creepy to me and full of religious overtones. I don't like the "be good or Santa won't bring you any presents." That seems cruel to me. Inflicting needless worry on the part of your kids as blackmail in order to affect their behavior. Much as religion does this. "Be good or you won't go to Heaven. You'll go to Hell." I like to think of being good because it is the right thing to do. You should be good because it makes other people feel good and you feel good too, not because of some imaginary threat.

Furthermore, I can't tell you how many children I have seen run from Santa crying. Forcing your kids to sit on a Stranger's lap to ask for gifts seems so wrong to me on so many levels. I was just at a Christmas party where the host's child spent TWO HOURS in her room and would not come out until Santa had left. She is 6 years old and beleives in Santa and was talking about him for weeks up until the event, but when it came time for Santa to be there, she freaked. None of the other kids liked Santa at all. NONE. They ran from him. They cried. My daughter put her hands over her face to shield her eyes from him. My son, who is 7, was instructed to be nice and go along with it for the sake of the other kids, which he did. He was the only one who didn't take at least 20 minutes of prodding to sit on Santa's lap. Santa was at this party for two hours, and there were dozens of children there, and mine, the only one who doesn't believe in Santa was the only one who would go near him.

Also, I don't know if he would have bought the whole Santa thing for very long anyway. He has a very, very good grasp on reality/fiction. He knew the Easter Bunny at Target was a guy in a suit before I said a word to the contrary when he was 3. I just don't see the point. Without Santa, children can see that their parents who love them care enough about them to provide all these wonderful toys for them, traditions, and fun. It isn't heaped on someone that isn't real. It eliminates the problems with that really mean and nasty kid down the street getting so much from Santa, while that other kid in your class who is really, really nice didn't get much at all.

A woman on the other board I frequent regularly has two children one 9 and one 7. THe 9 year old doesn't beleive anymore and told the 7 year old to go look in Mom's closet. So, the 7 year old does and finds Santa's gift to her brother. She doesn't know it is Santa's gift. So, now this lady has to take away the 9-year-olds gift, because she has threatened that if you don't beleive in Santa, he won't bring anything. The 7-year-old saw it, and she must lie further to suspend her belief. So, she is going to have that come from her instead, and give the 9 year old snowman poop and a letter saying that he shouldn't have led his sister to snoop on Christmas from Santa. How wrong is that? And everyone thought this was a great idea!! How about it is ruining Christmas by making both kids feel horrible? The 9-year-old will feel bad about being punished Christmas morning. He will still get the same # of gifts, but he will wonder. The 7-year-old will feel guilty because she got caught snooping and now her brother doesn't get anything from Santa. Wrong, wrong, wrong. I just hate that. Making Christmas punitive and unfun just to continue the Santa myth. Bleck.

So, on so many, and all levels, I really despise Santa.

I can see your points. I really don't like the "snowman poop" thing ... that's pretty rotten.

I guess for me Santa is just a big part of the tradition, and I remember loving the idea when I was a kid - although now as an adult some of the "see you when you're sleeping" , etc. do seem pretty creepy.

Thanks for your answer - like I said - I was just wondering.

I hope you all had a fun day (assuming Chad was home!).

[Rapunzel]

I never let my kids sit in a stranger's lap - no matter what they are dressed like!

When we moved in to our current congregation's boundaries they had this old guy who volunteered to be Santa at the Christmas party eight years in a row. My kids never sat in his lap because he creeped me out. Turns out he was a convicted pedophile. I'm on the activities committee now and, needless to say, when we planned our Christmas party for our ward (congregation) we did NOT have a Santa coming in.

I actually know a few LDS people who also can't stand Santa - but for different reasons. They believe he stands for the commercialization of a religious holiday and that the Santa Claus myth/tradition detracts from the true reason for the holiday celebration. I don't feel that way - but I've always thought it an interesting and thought-provoking point of view.

Sorry for the hijack.... :santasleigh:

Jennifer

[planet]

Heidi,

I completely respect that you have a thoughtful reason for hating Santa. I love the whole Santa thing because we didn't have it growing up. We included Santa in our holiday for the first time this year since he was part of a Polar Express Train ride we did. I actually hadn't thought about the creepiness factor or pedophiles! I won'y be looking at Santa the same again.

[SueC]

The snowman poop thing is terrible, who would do that??? We're believers here, but I respect those that don't. I think this might be the last year Maya believes, she is really starting to question the whole thing. Once she figures it out, we'll pull her aside and have a talk, and I'm sure she'll play along for the benefit of her siblings.

[houseelf]

Heidi,

I agree with many of your points. DS (just under six) figured out the Easter bunny last Spring. He asked me 4 times this season whether Santa was real. I kept on replying "what do you think?" Finally, he stated, "Mom, I know that you have a secret room for Santa presents". This happened on Christmas eve driving back from Kris's house.

I did not refute his conviction but admitted that Santa was a sweet tradition to help celebrate Christ's birthday. I felt like my parental integrity was on the line and I want to encourage him to talk freely with me. I'll admit that I was disappointed and DH was somewhat angered that I didn't try to preserve the myth longer, but I went with my gut. There is no easy answer here.

Yes, every milestone is bittersweet, but I felt like I had to meet my kid where he was at rather than where I wanted him to be. Does that make any sense? It just seems odd that we're talking about strangers, inappropriate touching, peer pressure, greed, morality, etc. and now all of the sudden I'm supposed to convince him of this elaborate and illogical scheme which defies everything that we talk about the other 364 days of the year.

I'm sure that I could have hoodwinked him longer but it just didn't feel right to me. I shot from the hip. I also warned him that part of being a big boy was preserving this tradition for others and letting them figure it out for themselves. We'll see how this goes. Sometimes I'm blown away by his maturity and other times I'm dismayed by his immaturity. I guess this is what an almost 6 year old boy is like.

I have kind of mixed emotions on this so I hope that I made the right decision. It is such a crap shoot.

Kelly

[SueC]

I think you did the right think Kelly, it sounds like he was ready. I remember as a kid figuring it out and pretending to still be in the dark because I wasn't ready to let go of the magic. (I also thought I would get fewer presents, which didn't end up being the case). DH and I did feel a little bad coming up with bullsh*t answers to some of her questions, though. We had several conversations about whether or not it was right, but in the end we agreed that the magic of Christmas is way too fun and we should try to preserve it if we can.

[Vanquisher]

Sue,

I'm not saying you did the wrong thing. You did what you felt is best for your kids. So, don't take what I say as a jab, because it's not.

I just wanted to address "magic at Christmas." I think that there is a ton of magic at Christmas without Santa. There are still penty of suprises, finding that special gift, finding things that are really neat that they didn't even ask for, stockings filled with goodies and little treasures, a nice Christmas breakfast, helping mom make a secret gift for dad, and dad get a secret gift for mom. There's special dinners, parties, making cookies, getting packages in the mail. There is waiting with anticipation and watching all the presents grow underneath the tree.

Christmas can still be magic, and in fact, I think more magical because it is you and your kids performing all the magic. The focus is shifted to the family magic. I think Santa tends to be the focus of Christmas and draws the attention from all the other things that are really, truly magical and full of wonder to something that is made up. It always felt so nice to me that my parents had gone to the trouble of finding my Cabbage Patch Kid and my sister's Teddy Ruxpin. For my kids it was magical that we got him his x-box game that he really wanted and some other things he didn't expect. Wows were heard all morning. He had so much fun watching me make his dad a University of Utah scrub cap from fabric I found in South Carolina, knowing that he would never expect it. Where on earth would I find that fabric anyway? (I'm amazed I did myself with 4 days until Christmas! DH was a little late this year on telling me this would be a good present.) He thought it was really fun to pick out Lexi's tinkerbell chair. He loved that this was his present to her and that she loved it when she opened it and sat in it right away.

Dh grew up with the focus on Santa, and we had a house without. He could have gone either way. He tells me though, that he is glad we did it this way. He thinks it just feels better. I'm glad.

Plus, there's the little magic that he knows that no other kids do. His parents let him in on the fact that there is no Santa. He has his own special secret.

[Vanquisher]

A side note--

Christmas is still my favorite holiday and for my kids too. It is huge at my house. I go all out. So imagine, a huge holiday without the religion and without the Santa. It's what works for us.

[SueC]

I didn't take it as a jab at all Heidi! It sounds like you guys had a great Christmas!