college credits in high school

[houseelf]

Many states now offer some type of college credit for free in HS.

My typical gut reaction to anything like this is a hard no. I have learned that rushing kids to the next stage, even if they appear ready in some aspect, usually has some unforeseen consequences.
Multiple things are making me consider it next year for my current sophomore daughter.

First DS1, a college sophomore, is 1000% in favor of it and wishes he would have had some community college experience before going off to a university. He took some APs in math and science which except for making him slightly more competitive, gave him nothing tangible. In fact, he had to take engineering calculus which is the bane of his existence, but I digress.

Second, DD attends a small, entitled school. While things have gotten better, I think providing her a bigger perspective socially might be in order.

Third, I'm lobbying hard for a gap year for her because she is young for her class and I want to give her a year back. She's thinking about studying abroad. A gap year doesn't seem so "off track" if there is a little taste of college before hand.

This is all new to me and seems like a big decision. Does anyone have any experience in this? I do know that between my own HS and college, I took a five hour calculus class at the local community college and it saved my bacon (and GPA). I thought that was an awesome transition. College and HS have changed a ton, however.

Thoughts? Advice? Should she toe-dip her first year taking mostly HS classes and 1 college class or go all in? What sort of things do I not even know to consider?

[fluffhead]

I took all college courses in my senior year of high school. It was a great experience, and saved me a ton of time in college, got me out of all kinds of requirements, etc.
That said....socially I was always in a peer group that was way older and more mature than me. I graduated college at a very young age and had NO idea what I wanted to do with my life. So there's that.
Kids taking APs in my school generally don't want to take the exam - many schools are not giving credit, and they figure it's just a hassle. So now the college board has pushed the registration deadline back to October, so at least seniors will pay the fees since they don't know if they got into their first choice. I require my juniors to take the exam, and I tell them that I'll remove the AP designation on their transcript if they don't (I don't actually know if I have the power to do that..)
In junior year I think a college course would be great. More in senior year.
Gap year? My daughter is on one now - she was all concerned about "losing" a year, but I think she's getting so much out of it and has grown up enormously. So I'm all for it.

[spotty_dog]

I would rather send my children to dual enrollment at the community college, than sign them up for AP classes. But I don't think either is a substitute for university-level instruction. At my small district, I am gathering that the top students tend to take about a half-time load at the community college for their junior and senior years. The diversity of the community college population (from dual-enrollment teens to second-career retraining adults and everything in between) is such that it doesn't "feel" like rushing them into a new stage -- even though I completely agree with you about the prudence of rushing kids into a new stage. Rather, it's just an extension of the current stage. I think it's a great introduction to the executive function requirements of college classes, and a nice way to extend the admittedly limited offerings at a high school with fewer than 300 students. But I worry about the teaching quality.

In this day and age I am starting to think that most students could use a gap year before college.

What are your concerns?

[SoonerTexan]

Well obviously I have no parental experience in this, but I'm still *only* (haha) 10 years out of college and my last sibling is still up at OU!

I think it depends on the kid, the high school, and college plans. In my high school, the students taking the AP courses were the ones who cared academically. Not all of them took the test or got credit, but I chose to do some courses (most of my math and Chemistry) in regular classes and the difference in peers was stark. Honestly, the teachers were better too.

On the downside, some of the classes were way more difficult and intense than their college counterparts and some caused unnecessary stress. In theory my college GPA might have been higher if I had some of that fluff in their too. AP credits were GPA neutral, so my GPA was made up primarily of upper level courses.

Taking AP courses gave me some 40+ hours of college credit (with about 30 of it useful towards my degrees) and allowed me to do a dual degree. It allowed DH to take it easy on the pre-med courseload. It allowed my sister (who was stressing about tuition money) to graduate a year early. It allowed my brother to keep up with the demands of ROTC and classes. It probably didn't do much for my other brother or sister--although she's having a bit of a mental health breakdown now and dropped a whole semester of courses (long story).

I do want my kids to be on campus freshman year vs community college barring circumstances I'm not yet aware of. The dorm life was part of growing up and I made most of my college friends in the dorms. Landing on campus as a sophomore would have meant a lot of missed life (and fun) experience.

My gut would say if she wants to try it, let her. If it is too much, I'm assuming she can always drop to the regular class? One or two AP classes a year isn't too intense--I think the stories of burnout come primarily from the kids taking on a full load on top of ridiculous extracurricular activities. There's something to be said for knowing your strengths and playing to them (hence why I didn't take AP math...). In the end, you have educational experience and you know your daughter best--I feel like you are going to help her make the best decision for her.

So there's my 2 cents.

ETA: I'm 40 at heart, so I know my experience isn't the norm.

[OrionGrad]

It’s been a million years since I was in high school, so someone correct me if I’m wrong, but if you take community college courses in high school, those grades still get considered if you eventually apply to med school, correct? IIRC, DH had a friend who struggled to get into med school because he had done super poorly in a handful of cc courses when he was 17 or 18. Obviously it’s not a problem if your kid gets As, but I’d make sure they were aware of the potentially lasting consequences if grad school was in their future.

[houseelf]

That said....socially I was always in a peer group that was way older and more mature than me. I graduated college at a very young age and had NO idea what I wanted to do with my life. So there's that.

Yup she's the youngest in her class which makes for weird situations when as a sophomore she wants to date a summer birthday senior who is almost 3 years older than her. (Um...nope). She's already got that weird young age thing which is one of many reasons I am encouraging a Gap year with a specific plan to transition the following year to college.

Kids taking APs in my school generally don't want to take the exam - many schools are not giving credit, and they figure it's jus

. I get the sense that APs are meaning less and less except for demonstrating academic rigor and teachers generally want to teach these classes so they *tend* to be taught better. (obviously there are exceptions). Also, peers in these courses often (not always) demonstrate a touch more long term planning for things like college, career, etcetera although I'm sure many of them are vaping in the bathroom and snapping away in class too.

What are your concerns?

. I don't isolate her but I think a breather from the bullshiz that can be high school could offer a new perspective. I'm not into overloading kids with unnecessary executive time schedules. I want her to be successful academically, socially, and emotionally. I never was a full believer in Sheryl Sandburg's Lean In. I believe that emotional and personal growth as well as downtime deserve equal billing to leaning into the career. While my kids live somewhat typical suburban lifestyles, I typically decline things like travel teams, zero bell additional course loading, playing two sports at once, and all the other things that have become common. I guess I'm more of a rec league/ymca summer camp sort of mom? College credit plus feels a little bit like the creep that has happened across American childhoods so that more, bigger, better, faster is de rigueur. (Yes, yes, many children thrive under 20 hours a week of competitive gymnastics. My kids don't. That's a lie. Strike that. I, their mother, do not thrive when I'm paying a gajillion dollars and running all over creation with tired cranky kids. Judge away.).

If she does the college credit plus program, the first course will be on the easier side and it will be a face-to-face, not online. One of the motivation is for her to broaden her horizon a bit and give her a protected taste of what is to come.

Honestly, hmmm...what are my concerns? ...I don't know enough to know what to be concerned about, but I'm prepared to worry!! LOL. Just kidding. Sort of. I don't know enough to have concerns so I'm information gathering at this point.

[PrincessFiona]

The post secondary education option is very popular here. Many kids graduate from high school with an associate’s degree. Obviously that can save a lot in tuition. The catch is that while the state schools accept all of the credits, not every private school will. I’d go for it really.


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[spotty_dog]

While my kids live somewhat typical suburban lifestyles, I typically decline things like travel teams, zero bell additional course loading, playing two sports at once, and all the other things that have become common. I guess I'm more of a rec league/ymca summer camp sort of mom?

Right?! And the pressure is real here. My family is SO bucking the trend, even in middle school, when we stick to rec league in a single sport, instead of doing multiple sports of school intermurals with 1-2 hours of weeknight travel to away games.

But around here, the academic pressure isn't there and the coursework just isn't that rigorous. My kids are bright, and they don't study, because they don't have to. I don't think they'll have to in high school either. So when I say "executive function," I mean, "The skills involved in planning out a thing that needs to take place over time, and doing the steps in order before the deadline." Whether that's a big presentation or paper, or a difficult test, or any of the organizational demands that are just a bit higher on community college kids than on high school kids. High school still holds kids' hands right up into junior and senior years, as far as I can tell. Free community college through dual enrollment appeals to me, not because it means less time spent in actual college or a break on the bill, but because it's exposure to that higher expectation of managing their own time.

If she does the college credit plus program, the first course will be on the easier side and it will be a face-to-face, not online. One of the motivation is for her to broaden her horizon a bit and give her a protected taste of what is to come.

I think this is a perfect reason to take a CC class as a junior.

[mommax3]

The HS here offers classes for college credit (through Indiana University, taught by appropriately credentialed (master’s degree or above) HS teachers), and my boys have all taken several of them. Really, they are the only viable options in core subjects for college bound kids by the time they get to their junior and senior years. Having the extra credits allowed my older two to change their majors pretty drastically after a year of college and still graduate on time. I do worry about the quality of teaching they get vs. what they would get if they took the same class on a college campus, but like I said, there aren’t really any other options here. My oldest (now a second year med student) would say that the grades he got in the college level classes he took in HS brought his undergraduate GPA down, and I think that is valid for certain types of smart kids who are a little behind the curve in organization and responsibility, as he was. My middle son’s gf graduated college in three years due to the amount of college credit she had when she graduated from HS, and for her, I think that it may have been a mistake, because she is floundering a little bit now, and could have used another year on campus to finish growing up. Still, it does represent a substantial way to save $$$ on college tuition, and for so many families, that is of primary importance. Like someone else said, I have always planned on my kids being on campus in college for four years, but that just isn’t an option for many families. So, that was a long-winded way of saying that I agree with Kelly’s reservations, but having my kids graduate with some college credits under their belts hasn’t been a bad thing.


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[houseelf]

My middle son’s gf graduated college in three years due to the amount of college credit she had when she graduated from HS, and for her, I think that it may have been a mistake, because she is floundering a little bit now, and could have used another year on campus to finish growing up.

Yes! This potentially could be create a situation where I am just cutting off even another year of her childhood? I mean her young age is already a thing.

I think we're going to do maybe 3-4 HS courses and 1-2 college courses junior year. Part and parcel of this agreement, however, will be a gap year. If it goes well, she can take more her senior year, if not, oh well.

Anyhoo...thanks for the insight!

[Phoebe]

My daughter wanted to sign up for AP classes. Any classes on her schedule that offered dual credit were taken advantage of for the credits and cheaper tuition. She chose her path, but the classes were all Gen Ed credits. It has worked for her. There hasn’t been a college decision yet so I am not sure if all her credits will transfer.

For all that your daughter has been through for her age (physically, mentally and socially) and her late birthday, a Gap year might be helpful.





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[spaz]

All three of mine did dual credit. Middle one had 60 hours when he went. Graduated in 3 years ( could have done it in 2 1/2, but changed major.) and went straight to seminary. Oldest had 40 something hours between AP and dual credit. it really helped take the pressure off of him as a computer science majore. He could take 12-15 hours a semester instead of 17/18. Also, he took Calc I even though he already had credit. It was easy for him, but we thought it was better than entering in Calc II. Both of those boys were homeschooled, so it was a way for them to get out from under me. It worked quite well.

My daughter is a senior. Her private school encouraged doing dual credit and even had a prof from a local Christian college came and taught classes on campus. So she had 15 hours by the end of her junior year. Then they announced they were closing the school at the end of that year after 25 years. ): 7 of the 8 chose to just do dual credit instead of enrolling in a different school for their senior year. I'm sort of supervising them. Not ideal, but it is what it is. They are having get-togethers each month. They are having a graduation at my church. They had raised nearly 4,000 dollars their junior year for their senior trip, so we are still taking it. Nice thing is that since they are all dual credit, we can take it in May because they get out so early. My daughter is taking drama classes but we won't count them for credit even if they allow it, just like my son's calculus because it is in her major and she wants to make friends with fellow freshman. Like her brother, all of the credits will help her take less hours. She won't graduate early. Funny though, they will all be drama, music and dance classes. She will have done almost all of her academic classes.