b.c vs a.c

[Sheherezade]

This is a great discussion. I don't know where I stand on the subject - honestly. I have never felt offended by advice given by a non-parent on the internet or IRL. Maybe I don't ask enough.

I do weigh the advice given to me on any subject carefully -- and I consider the experience of the source. I can see the analogy to medical spouses or Flynn's teaching. It seems to be an issue of mutual respect. We all want to feel valued and respected. (At least, I do. ) When someone discounts any of our advice, it feels like they don't value our opinions or experience. That's hurtful.

I'm still disturbed because I can't tell what was so upsetting to sms in the last thread. I saw a comment by Ladybug and one by Genevieve.....but they were mild compared to some of the "events" we've had around here. I feel totally disconnected and thick-skinned. I must be missing an X chromosome or something!

That said, I'm sure that I'd feel put out if someone started on one of my hot button issues, though - like wasting my degree or the likelihood of me ever looking physically fit or my lack of relationship with my own family.......I could go on and on. We all have hot button issues. Too bad we don't have warning labels in our tag lines. Of course, half the time, we aren't even aware what our issues are until someone comes along and presses the button.

I'm sorry if anyone was hurt. I don't have a problem getting advice from anyone on any topic and I will try not to be disrespectful in the future.

[Rapunzel]

Now...to poop on myself.

One of my dearest friends has 5 children....4 of whom are now grown...when we met, I was pregnant with Amanda, thought Andrew was...perfect..and that we were never going to have any parenting problems at all. I gawked over some of her parenting choices AND (judgement, judgement) felt free a few times to let some of my opinions fly...particularly when it came to the raising of her daughter, Fionnuala. The fact that this woman is still my friend is truly, truly a testament to her ability to love and forgive me. I was appalled...when her then-4 year old jumped all over my sofas and ran through the house while she continued to talk with me without flinching.....and one day, I actually told her....(OHHHHH, the SHAME) that I would NEVER have 5 children because I didn't think you could pay each child the attention that they deserve. I have no doubt that she felt that this was an indictment of her choice and that I felt she was responsible for some of her teen boys wilder ways. Ohhh..but I did....

The payback, the payback....she got a good chuckle when we had baby #4, but baby #5 has been purely...joyful for her. "What? You're having #5, Kris? Are you sure that's such a good idea?"

[Rapunzel]

You know, though, on the particular subject of parenting advice from non-parents:

On another site I was on recently I read a post by a woman whose friend had a vengeful family member call cps on her family. She is a full-time mom and homeschools.

A social worker showed up at her door - man without children - and proceeded to berate her specifically for 1)having dirty dishes in the sink and 2)for having a dirty floor.

His comments to her before departing? "I will be back tomorrow and I'd better be able to eat off of this floor." AND during the course of their conversation he stated, "There is NO excuse for a stay at home mom to EVER have dirty dishes in the sink."

I have heard SO MANY nightmares like this - it's ridiculous. And, it is a good example of someone without parenting experience being placed in a position of judgement over a parent - and simply not having any clue at all (while feeling quite well that they DO know it all - and well!). That social worker has the ability to make that family's life a living hell. He has the ability to try to take her children away from her if she doesn't meet his expectations.

This IS an issue on some levels.

And, the above is a good example as to why I believe that social workers, for example, should be required to be parents prior to entertaining the idea of dictating proper parenting to others.

[Sheherezade]

And, the above is a good example as to why I believe that social workers, for example, should be required to be parents prior to entertaining the idea of dictating proper parenting to others.

I wouldn't go this far - it does depend on the person. I've got my own pet project in the remaking of our world. I think that priests and nuns should "sign up" for service after they've lived a little. Widows and widowers would be perfect. They have all that sage life experience. Of course, I'm a non-religious, non-Catholic with absolutely no working knowledge of the priesthood. Slight disclaimer. It is fun to think how the world could be made different -- and it sucks when bad people are in positions of authority, whether they have parenting experience or not.

[DCJenn]

See what it gets down to really, is that we all really do genuinely care for each other. It's not different here than any other large and raucous family. There's just 500 of us.

There's bound to be differences of opinion, hurt feelings, steaming mad days. That's all OK because when my husband the dawkter has sent me over the edge I know I can post here and some will tell me it gets better, some will sympathize, some will say "oh dear god her husband is an ass."

It's all good, really.

I mean in total seriousness- Tabula Rasa and I are the definition of polar opposites in at least 80% of our opinions. But- we're in the same town and if she needed help in an emergency- I'd be there. It's that simple. When SueC needed help, Jenn P was there. Kelly and Kris have held hands throughout this crazy journey. I'm sure there are other stories as well.

That's what this place is really about- it's a 'home away from home' for most of us.

Jenn

[PrincessFiona]

Well, he'd better not come here because I have 3 children going to school and really NO excuse for my disaster of a house today!

If it makes anyone feel better, I used to weigh in on the sahm vs. working mom debate with a bra-burning, put 'em in daycare the day they're born enthusiasm. I worked as as I was allowed by german law, had a med school acceptance in the hand and planned on having a nanny come in while I thumped my chest and chanted "I am woman!" We all know how THAT worked out. They put that little baby in my arms and I 1. quit my job and 2. deferred med school forever....

Of course, being a sahm isn't all baking cookies and june cleaveresque either...which is why I struggle regularly with finding a balance for me of both professional and family....

kris

[Rapunzel]

And, the above is a good example as to why I believe that social workers, for example, should be required to be parents prior to entertaining the idea of dictating proper parenting to others.

I wouldn't go this far - it does depend on the person. I've got my own pet project in the remaking of our world. I think that priests and nuns should "sign up" for service after they've lived a little. Widows and widowers would be perfect. They have all that sage life experience. Of course, I'm a non-religious, non-Catholic with absolutely no working knowledge of the priesthood. Slight disclaimer. It is fun to think how the world could be made different -- and it sucks when bad people are in positions of authority, whether they have parenting experience or not.

Actually, I agree with your own little pet project there.

But, seriously, there are certain positions where, if you are placed in a position of authority over persons who have WAY more experience than you, you need to accept your ignorance and examine your level of compassion.

[PrincessFiona]

Kelly and Kris have held hands throughout this crazy journey. I'm sure there are other stories as well.

And...Kelly is leaving me

[Rapunzel]

Well, he'd better not come here because I have 3 children going to school and really NO excuse for my disaster of a house today!

If it makes anyone feel better, I used to weigh in on the sahm vs. working mom debate with a bra-burning, put 'em in daycare the day they're born enthusiasm. I worked as as I was allowed by german law, had a med school acceptance in the hand and planned on having a nanny come in while I thumped my chest and chanted "I am woman!" We all know how THAT worked out. They put that little baby in my arms and I 1. quit my job and 2. deferred med school forever....

Of course, being a sahm isn't all baking cookies and june cleaveresque either...which is why I struggle regularly with finding a balance for me of both professional and family....

kris

See, this is why we ALL need to be a tabula rasa - BLANK SLATE - until we get to those particular issues in life.... At least, I was completely blank on the subject of parenthood prior to being a parent....

[Rapunzel]

Kelly and Kris have held hands throughout this crazy journey. I'm sure there are other stories as well.

And...Kelly is leaving me

Where is Kelly going????

[Rapunzel]

No WAY! I thought nuns had a vow of celibacy as well!

Anyone hear of the new movement to allow married priests and nuns? (ie going back to the way it used to be centuries ago)

[Sheherezade]

See? I put my totally lame thinking out there with absolutely no authority to back it up, and you - you wonderful people you *sob* - you accepted it!!

I feel so loved.

[Rapunzel]

I hope God has a sense of humor.

He does - everytime I get pregnant my kids want a little brother.

So what do I have?

Four girls!!!

[Vishenka69]

I'm still trying to figure out what it is we're debating. I thought we've agreed to disagree a long time ago. :>

As for the whole "parenthood changes your outlook on life and don't give us any advice until you've been there" thing, I just try to stay out of the Parenting Forum as much as possible. I really don't feel I have anything of value to add. Whenever there's a thread in the general forum (like Kris's thread about Amanda), I feel that it's open for general discussion and pipe in.

Yes, every now and then someone will say something that will push your button, but hey that's life. There will always be someone who will piss you off and some battles are worth fighting while others are better off left alone. In the end Jenn is right we've got each other's back regardless of our political affiliation or parenting status.

[rainbabies]

i need a bagel...an everything bagel with a schmeer of cream cheese.