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Seems like a bad idea...

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  • Seems like a bad idea...

    It was revealed today that, for the past 4-5 months, Sandy Berger, the disgraced former National Security Advisor to President Clinton, has been an unpaid advisor to Hillary Clinton's campaign on issues of national security.

    Sandy Berger plead guilty in federal court to (post-9/11) stealing and destroying classified documents from the National Archives related to, among other things, the Clinton Administration's handling of Kobar Tower bombings and African embassy bombings. He snuck out the documents by stuffing them in his pants and socks. It remains unknown, to this day, all of the documents he took and the significance of those documents (clearly, though, it would be safe to assume that they made the Clinton administration look bad). It's not like this is a little misunderstanding that resulted in inadvertent destruction of documents. The sentencing judge deviated upward from the recommended fine at sentencing (5x) due to the seriousness of the crime and Berger avoided being disbarred by the DC Bar by surrendering his license to practice (which also got him out of having to plead the 5th or testify under immunity before the Bar regarding the documents). This was a big deal. This was a breach of national security in a time of war.

    He probably would be a great resource for Hillary (given his professional experience as well as in light of the fact that he's clearly willing to go to jail in Bill's interest). I am not debating that. But just because someone could be strategically helpfully doesn't mean they deserve the privilege of serving. It seems incredibly irresponsible to turn to a convicted criminal--who is convicted of crimes relating to national security--as someone who you think is appropriate to advise a potential future president. His willingness to prioritize the Clintons' interests over those of the nation (these documents were highly classified and federal law prohibited their removal and destruction) would make him an unacceptable choice as an advisor (whether paid or not).

    What was she thinking?

  • #2
    Re: Seems like a bad idea...

    I'm not happy w/ several of her recent decisions to be honest...

    I'm all about being loyal to your friends but when your friends do stupid things then you have them over for dinner, you don't give them a job. (paid or not)

    Jenn

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Seems like a bad idea...

      Originally posted by DCJenn
      I'm not happy w/ several of her recent decisions to be honest...

      I'm all about being loyal to your friends but when your friends do stupid things then you have them over for dinner, you don't give them a job. (paid or not)

      Jenn
      Jenn:

      This was NOT the answer I wanted from you, since I know your feelings towards Hill! This is not fun. Ah, I guess we can save it for debates over policy.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Seems like a bad idea...

        i'm actually starting to wonder if her lead is not somehow being masterminded by the republicans working to serve up the candidate they think they'll be able to beat.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Seems like a bad idea...

          Originally posted by Jane
          i'm actually starting to wonder if her lead is not somehow being masterminded by the republicans working to serve up the candidate they think they'll be able to beat.
          I've heard that, too. I think that it is very hard for a lot of liberals to understand how truly, deeply disliked she is by a lot of people. She brings out the most visceral reactions on both sides. It's quite extraordinary, actually.

          Republicans are acutely aware of these feelings, though, and I think it blinds some to her potential. They see her as less of a threat to the capture of the undecideds...much more so, I think, than they see Obama, even though Obama is more liberal. Obama is dynamic, attractive, blessed with a wonderful speaking voice, happily married, candid, and completely self-made--all traits that Hillary lacks, and all traits that will make him likeable to the swing vote. I think a lot of Republicans think that it would be harder to beat those qualities than to beat Hillary's shrillness and lack of glamour and personality.

          But, that being said, Republicans who strategize based on the "let's hope we run against the least likeable" are really underestimating the Clintons, and completely overestimating their own candidate. If, as things progress, it looks that Hillary will not be able to win over those people who have not already made up their minds about her, she will bring out her husband. And, for that, many people will vote for her purely by association (it's is kind of sad, from a feminist perspective, but I guess that's another story). "Vote for me 'cause you liked my spouse" is not uncommon in politics--right now, the First Lady of Argentina (who, coincidentally, is also a senator with little in the way of her own significant experience in an elected position) is the front-runner in that country's national election.

          Republicans are absolutely foolish to think that it won't work. Bill is an incredibly likeable guy. He is warm, approachable, and appears genuine. He convinced N.O.W. that he is a women's advocate despite his philandering and sexual harrassment; he's convinced entire congregations in Harlem that he is (as Toni Morrison called him) the First Black President (which Hillary clearly cannot do--her attempt to adopt that style of preaching oration last year sounded--albeit unintentionally--mocking). Hillary, by contrast, cannot convince anyone that she knows the difference between the Yankees and the Cubs, or why it matters. Bill will be an absolutely fabulous asset for Hillary, and the Republicans should not underestimate her (and Bill's) formidability.

          I think either Obama or Hillary spells a very hard battle for any of the current Republican contenters. For whatever my opinion's (not) worth!

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Seems like a bad idea...

            Originally posted by GrayMatterWife
            I think that it is very hard for a lot of liberals to understand how truly, deeply disliked she is by a lot of people. She brings out the most visceral reactions on both sides. It's quite extraordinary, actually.
            oh no - I totally get that. she is to divisive, IMO, to be able to pull it off. If the republicans throw a moderate up there, lots of dems would vote for that person just b/c it's not Hillary.

            FWIW, she was raised in Chicago, so I'm guessing she can handle the Cubs vs. Yankees thing. Runs vs. touchdowns or goals, probably not.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Seems like a bad idea...

              Originally posted by Jane
              Originally posted by GrayMatterWife
              I think that it is very hard for a lot of liberals to understand how truly, deeply disliked she is by a lot of people. She brings out the most visceral reactions on both sides. It's quite extraordinary, actually.
              oh no - I totally get that. she is to divisive, IMO, to be able to pull it off. If the republicans throw a moderate up there, lots of dems would vote for that person just b/c it's not Hillary.

              FWIW, she was raised in Chicago, so I'm guessing she can handle the Cubs vs. Yankees thing. Runs vs. touchdowns or goals, probably not.
              Tim Russert recently asked her, if the Cubs (to whom she's sworn loyalty based on her childhood) and the Yankees (to whom she's sworn loyalty based on her current residence--although it's unclear why she picked the Yankees over the Mets) played in the Series, for whom would she cheer?

              Her response: She's have to alternate.

              That is extremely hard for either a Cubs or a Yankees fan to understand--cheering for convenience. There's just no such thing, for a true fan.

              She should have just said, boldly and without hesitation, "Love my Yankees, but it'd have to be the Cubs. Sorry, A-Rod, but it's my midwestern roots! Let's just hope we don't see that Series, at least while I'm in office!" [insert good-natured "hahaha!"]. Everyone would have understood that: it's her childhood team. What was she afraid of? Losing the Bronx vote?

              She passed up on a great chance to have been seen as a human being, with loves and loyalties, and a childhood with warm memories. Instead, she seemed like an equivocating politician, strategizing for the least offensive answer. Come'on...it's baseball, not health care reform! Just have fun with it...

              The truly incredible thing, though, is that she didn't seem prepared for the question. As everyone knows, Tim Russert is a rabid Buffalo Bills fan, and loves to talk about sports--especially sports in NY. This question was not--to employ a painful apt phrase--from left field. She should have had a well-practiced (which, in politics, means so rehearsed that it seemed natural--hahaha) answer to this one.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Seems like a bad idea...

                I'm not giving up my love for her. I'll be there to console her, but I'm going w/ Richardson in the primary.

                Jenn

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Seems like a bad idea...

                  Originally posted by DCJenn
                  I'm not giving up my love for her. I'll be there to console her, but I'm going w/ Richardson in the primary.

                  Jenn
                  Richardson? Really? That's interesting...may I ask why (esp. given your crush on the Hill)?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Seems like a bad idea...

                    Because he's actually DONE the foreign relations bit, he's been forward thinking in his environmental issues in New Mexico, I like his immigration plan (aka- realistic w/out building the Berlin Wall redeux) and generally I think of the lot, besides Biden (who god love him, just can't SHUT UP) he's the only one who has a true sense of what is happening in the world.

                    Jenn

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Seems like a bad idea...

                      Originally posted by Pollyanna
                      Originally posted by Jane
                      i'm actually starting to wonder if her lead is not somehow being masterminded by the republicans working to serve up the candidate they think they'll be able to beat.

                      I wouldn't give the current batch that much credit.
                      No kidding. I am so unimpressed with the lot of them -- both sides. Depressing.

                      I don't think Hillary should be the candidate for most of the reasons mentioned above. Edwards -- the med malpractice stuff. Obama -- he thinks there should be federal aid to people who got screwed on mortgages --federal dollars to help pay mortgages? And he chose Pena as his campaign manager/director/whatever? Nope.

                      I don't like any of the Republicans either.

                      :run: going back to my cave :run:

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Seems like a bad idea...

                        Originally posted by cupcake
                        Originally posted by Pollyanna
                        Originally posted by Jane
                        i'm actually starting to wonder if her lead is not somehow being masterminded by the republicans working to serve up the candidate they think they'll be able to beat.

                        I wouldn't give the current batch that much credit.
                        No kidding. I am so unimpressed with the lot of them -- both sides. Depressing.

                        I don't think Hillary should be the candidate for most of the reasons mentioned above. Edwards -- the med malpractice stuff. Obama -- he thinks there should be federal aid to people who got screwed on mortgages --federal dollars to help pay mortgages? And he chose Pena as his campaign manager/director/whatever? Nope.

                        I don't like any of the Republicans either.

                        :run: going back to my cave :run:
                        Let's create an iMSN ticket. We certainly know how to manage things and have great organizational skills. Plus, I think several of us have truly remarkably well-developed BS detectors. How about a DCJenn/Pollyanna ticket? Both sides of the aisle, diverse backgrounds...it could play.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Seems like a bad idea...

                          Originally posted by GrayMatterWife

                          Republicans are acutely aware of these feelings, though, and I think it blinds some to her potential. They see her as less of a threat to the capture of the undecideds...much more so, I think, than they see Obama, even though Obama is more liberal. Obama is dynamic, attractive, blessed with a wonderful speaking voice, happily married, candid, and completely self-made--all traits that Hillary lacks, and all traits that will make him likeable to the swing vote.
                          I'd have to disagree with you on the Hillary re: attractiveness. I've heard quite a few guys comment on her MILF appeal and that she's quite the cougar. I even heard Rush Limbaugh mention her yaps.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Seems like a bad idea...

                            Originally posted by monkey7247
                            Originally posted by GrayMatterWife

                            Republicans are acutely aware of these feelings, though, and I think it blinds some to her potential. They see her as less of a threat to the capture of the undecideds...much more so, I think, than they see Obama, even though Obama is more liberal. Obama is dynamic, attractive, blessed with a wonderful speaking voice, happily married, candid, and completely self-made--all traits that Hillary lacks, and all traits that will make him likeable to the swing vote.
                            I'd have to disagree with you on the Hillary re: attractiveness. I've heard quite a few guys comment on her MILF appeal and that she's quite the cougar. I even heard Rush Limbaugh mention her yaps.

                            Not to be completely catty, but have you seen those calves? Sausages. Yikes. They certainly explain the dowdy pantsuits. And the short "practical" haircut that rings of a slightly aged local news broadcaster? The whole package screams, "Asexual and completely focused on my job to the exclusion of any sense of fun."

                            But, then, I guess it would be better than having a super-sexy commander in chief. We don't want our boys in uniform giving their leader the wrong kind of salute.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Seems like a bad idea...

                              Now, now, don't insult the DC uniform for Women of A Certain Age Who Are Politicians.

                              Helmet Head abounds on the Hill. Especially for those who come from below the Mason-Dixon line. Political Party has nothing to do w/ it, either.

                              In fact one of the funniest commentaries EVER was written by Tammy Baldwin, D-WI who is a lesbian. She wrote this entire column about "do I or don't I" and only when you get to the end do you realize she's talking about dying her hair blonde.

                              and yes, pants are much more flattering on Hill.

                              Sadly, not enough Hill denizens have taken that path...

                              and we REALLY have got to get rid of the guys w/ the paunches hanging over suits they bought 10 years ago. Nast-y. When we lived 5 doors away from Hastert I was always afraid he'd code right there and the Secret Service would come get Rick to render aid.

                              Jenn

                              Comment

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