Stimulus Bill

[PrincessFiona]

Re: Stimulus Bill

We will be paying the alternative minimum tax and won't be getting any little stimulus check.

boohoo.

I wouldn't have as big of a problem with it if our money was going to help fund universal healthcare, lower the costs of a university education for everyone and was generally going to support the welfare of this country and not pet projects like....Bush's unnecessary war with iraq.



There...threw some gasoline on a different fire.

[DCJenn]

Re: Stimulus Bill

I wouldn't even mind the money going to the military to you know, pay the medical personnel salaries concurrent with what their civilian counterparts make.

(what nurse with a BSN ONLY makes mid-30s? Military Captains, that's who. and they don't even get the bonuses that the docs get. Seriously)

Jenn

Re: Stimulus Bill

Does anyone else feel like this stimulus package and the 2001 package is a integral part of the American financial mental demise? Ok so your president says "I'm going to give you money. Please go spend ALL of it, or the economy (a.k. your homeland) will suffer." Hello the American economy is at a savings deficit, and telling people that spending helps is just fueling the stupid people's fire. And... how much of this money is just going into China's pocket for low cost goods? I think this is part of the American demise, that savings isn't a priority, spending is. Get rid of the president... please.

And I for one agree

But see this is where we fundamentally disagree. I think that "giving back" is my responsibility -- my duty. Sure, some government programs don't work and the money is wasted. I'd rather have programs that "barely" help people in place (some are SURELY helped) than do nothing to help my fellow man. My money is wasted in some programs because people are not perfect.

We live a pretty posh life in comparison the the rest of the world. If all I had to live on was $100k, that would be more money than any of my family makes, and they live pretty good. They save, so they can go on family vacations, fix their cars and so on, but they live nice lives. I should be so blessed to live on $100K. So if they are going to tax heavily for making six digets, that is ok IMO. But that doesn't say I can't weigh in on how I think they should spend it. And I for one don't want my taxes to go into the pocket of millions to pay for foreign goods that hardly help our economy IMO. I'll take the rebate, but would never vote for it.

Re: Stimulus Bill

We will be paying the alternative minimum tax and won't be getting any little stimulus check.

boohoo.

Kris, IMO, instead of this stupid gimmicky stimulus bill, they should fix the AMT. Every year they wait to fix it means more people who are subject to it, more revenue from it and greater budget dependence.
:banghead:

Does anyone else feel like this stimulus package and the 2001 package is a integral part of the American financial mental demise?

I don't know if it is integral but I don't think it helps. Like I said above (not very clearly) -- part of this stimulus package is a change to the mortgage market in hopes of keeping it afloat. Encouraging people to spend instead of save or pay down debt doesn't really help the mortgage situation.

[PrincessFiona]

Re: Stimulus Bill

Nellie,

McCain wants to get rid of the AMT. Thomas is starting to lean that way.

[alison]

Re: Stimulus Bill

Nellie,

McCain wants to get rid of the AMT. Thomas is starting to lean that way.

Does Thomas have US citizenship?

Re: Stimulus Bill

They all say that...the problem is how do you replace that lost income which increases every year? It is such a mess. I think we avoid it this year but I know we will get it next. :banghead:

[GrayMatterWife]

Re: Stimulus Bill

You don't like it? Move.

WOW That is a bit over the top and unnecessary. I'm out, you all know where I stand on taxes.

No, don't move, Tara (besides, what would you do? Unless you renounced your citizenship, you'd still have to pay federal income taxes to the US government, regardless of where you earned the income...). I need you here! Stay and fight! I'm with you, sister! Don't abandon us like-minded folks to the nanny state!!

[GrayMatterWife]

Re: Stimulus Bill

I think that "giving back" is my responsibility -- my duty.

If you mean that "paying taxes" is a responsibility and a duty as a citizen, I completely agree with you. It is an obligation of any society created under a Lockean theory of social contract. However, I'm with Tara in the sense that: (1) I don't see paying taxes as "giving"--there's nothing voluntary about it, really, since you may be held liable for nonpayment under civil and criminal law; and (2) I plan to minimize the amount of tax that I am required to pay by properly and legally utilizing every option made available to me under the law. But, in doing so, I also would never "skirt the law" by making questionable representations on my tax forms. Either I respect (and therefore obey) the laws under which we live, or I don't. But if I do--and I do--and if I don't like a particular tax law, I participate in the legal system to change that law. I don't abuse the existing law to mete out what I believe is a just result. I hate idiots who blatantly rip off the IRS because they think the federal tax system is oppressive--you know, take a bunch of improper deductions, don't do withholding, etc. I used to see appeals by these nuts all the time when I was clerking for the US Ct. of Appeals. You know, the ones who claim that the federal income tax laws are unconstitutional, etc. Whack jobs, all of them. Screwing the IRS is not a necesary, effective or even symbolically meaningful demonstration of "civil disobedience." It just makes you look like what you are: a thief and a fraud. Paine and Thoreau would have been mortified.

Oh, and on the Stimulus Bill--I honestly don't really know what to think. I don't understand short-term macroeconomics very well, and I can't say that I have an educated opinion to offer. My "gut" finds the reasoning a little suspicious--giving the middle and lower classes $600 a person to spend will help to keep the consumer-based economy out of recession? I don't understand how, other than maybe by the power of positive thinking. But then, I guess we're also taking about, on the whole, purported millions and millions of dollars injected in the short-term into the retail economy. I have no idea if it will work and I am not really convinced that a majority of people will spend it immediately and to buy new things (personally. I'm not spending it...it's going into the bank. You know, Glenn Beck of CNN had an interesting thought: if you want to ENSURE that this money will be used, in full, in the short-term, why not give it back on short-shelf-life debit cards, like were used after Katrina? That way, you can be sure that the money will not be used to pay down already-existing debt or placed into savings. Hmmmm. But then, maybe people would just use the debit cards in leiu of their regular spending, thereby still resulting in the same failure to make a net injection into the economy). But, despite my lack of a PhD in economic policy, my gut is also always glad to see some of my tax money coming back to me legally, because I believe that the individual is a better spender of the money than the government.