venturing into the "war" zone

I'm posting this with a little fear & trepidation...

If I were a single-issue voter this election, the war would be the issue. If I had to guess, realistically, I'd say Obama probably will be our next president. To me, that means we'll try to pull out of Iraq sooner... but surely we've learned not to just leave a country (whether we've attacked them or provided them with weapons & training to defend themselves against another country) without taking adequate time to help rebuild their infrastructure.

So talk to me - what do you see happening when we end the war in Iraq? What has either candidate said about how he'll do it?

[DCJenn]

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

If anyone thinks we will just up and leave Iraq, they're on crack. We will probably have a military presence there FOREVER. Obama had talked about pulling the Combat Troops out (which is what the Iraqi's have also been asking), McCain wants to stay until we "win" (as far as I can tell, this is undefined).

We will probably always have military advisors, medical and legal personnel, State Department personnel (having just built the BIGGEST embassy ever, anywhere, in any country where we have personnel), Defense department staff, etc. The hospital that we built in Balad is totally state of the art. We have a base set up in Mosul still.

It's all about semantics but no, we're not leaving for a VERY long time. We definitely need to get the majority of the troops out, in my opinon because I think we're missing opportunities in Afghanistan. In reality, I have no doubt that should my husband deploy again, it will continue to be either Iraq or Afghanistan.

Jenn

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

If anyone thinks we will just up and leave Iraq, they're on crack. We will probably have a military presence there FOREVER. Obama had talked about pulling the Combat Troops out (which is what the Iraqi's have also been asking), McCain wants to stay until we "win" (as far as I can tell, this is undefined).

I completely agree with Jenn, and the "crack" comment about made me fall off my chair laughing. Obama says we'll pull out right away because it plays well with his base. McCain says stay until we will because it plays well with his base. It's just all a game and in the end a "pull out" is not happening.

ITA.

[madeintaiwan]

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

Can we say Japan, South Korea, and Vietnam?

[DCJenn]

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

Let us not forget Germany, the Phillipines, Puerto Rico and Cuba?

J.

[madeintaiwan]

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

Let us not forget Germany, the Phillipines, Puerto Rico and Cuba?

J.

Yes, yes. I was trying not to lay it on too thick. I didn't want to sound like too much of an ungrateful whiner. Afterall, if it wasn't for the Vietnam war I would not be here today.

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

I agree with ALL OF YOU! How exciting!!!

[Vanquisher]

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

I agree with ALL OF YOU! How exciting!!!

Don't worry. I'm sure someone will pipe up who disagrees.

Unfortuantely, I want to bury my head in the sand and say pull out now! We're already screwed over there, lets cut our losses and leave. I know it isn't the right thing to do. I hate that, that can't be an answer. I'm pissed that we went there in the first place. I want to be completely immature about it and say, get OUT NOW!!

Sadly, I do recognize that we can't leave. Sadly, I can't believe the mess our current administration has gotten us into. Sadly, I know this is going to be an ongoing source of problems and money suck for our nation.

The only thing I can look to is what everyone else has already said. I trust Obama more than McCain to do what is best with the mess we have made (with the help of strong advisors) and to do as much as possible to get as many troops home as possible as soon as possible and to not go invading still more countries left and right and in the middle.

[GrayMatterWife]

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

. . . until we "win" (as far as I can tell, this is undefined).

I would love for someone--ANYONE, Rep, Dem, ANYONE--to offer a reliable, specific definition of this. Not provide some inanine list of "goals" that are achieved on a sliding scale. It would be great if we just knew what that "winning" meant. I want to stay until we "win," assuming that what I suspect "winning" is, also is what they mean by "winning." I don't want to "win" the way we "won" in Vietnam--declaring that we won and just go home and watch the disaster of our exodus. War now is not war a century ago. It's not like someone is going to surrender on the edge of a battleship and turn over their symbolic sword.

[GrayMatterWife]

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

It's just all a game and in the end a "pull out" is not happening.

I am just so glad that Obama and McCain are the ones talking about the need to pull out. If it were Clinton (Bill), we all know he'd be worried about an entirely different type of need to timely "pull out."

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

I agree with ALL OF YOU! How exciting!!!

Don't worry. I'm sure someone will pipe up who disagrees.

I'm doing my best!

I'm still really not satisfied with either candidate. *sigh*

Spinning off Abigail's post in the "Michelle" thread, I want to know that Obama has the "strength" or experience to manage the war. I think he'll have to rely so much on his advisors that I want to know what his resources are in terms of advisors before feeling comfortable with him.

I like the "walk softly but carry a big stick" idea. (And no, this is not a spinoff of Abigail's (2nd) post in this thread! ) I fear that Obama is an idealist, quick to throw away the stick and hope everyone else will do the same. Maybe this works on a very measured scale, but I don't think this is a good time for it. And I worry that McCain figures what's the point having a stick if you're not going to make good use of it. He seems like a good "all out war" leader when there's no other choice. I don't see him being satisfied leading in peacetime or desiring that very strongly.

Lily's idea of voting a split ticket is looking more and more desirable.

[DCJenn]

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

Well, I certainly HOPE that in terms of any kind of troops movement, either of the candidates would make more use of the ACTUAL military brass, rather than removing the ones that disagree with them. (as our current CiC has done)

The bottom line is that advisors are not a bad thing. In fact, I'd argue that one of the best things about Bill Clinton's cabinet was that his Sec. of Defense was a Republican. I would hope that the lesson that we as a nation take from the Iraq situation is that it's critical for our president to take dissenting views seriously, and not manipulate the situation to meet the politically expedient goals of the moment.

I sincerely hope that whomever is elected (and I do hope it's Obama because he seems better able to actually govern, as opposed to dictate) puts in Cabinet and senior advisors who will hold his feet to the flame on these issues and then we can be assured that the President has taken the information under advisement and is making what he thinks is the best decision for our country.

As opposed to our current situation.

jenn

PS- I also have serious problems w/ the saber rattling of the Republicans, even if it is just for show. (and I'm not sure that it is)

[Meenah]

Re: venturing into the "war" zone

Wow,we are all on the same page here.