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Palin's Speech

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  • #46
    Re: Palin's Speech

    Originally posted by Jane
    PALIN: "I have protected the taxpayers by vetoing wasteful spending ... and championed reform to end the abuses of earmark spending by Congress. I told the Congress 'thanks but no thanks' for that Bridge to Nowhere."

    THE FACTS: As mayor of Wasilla, Palin hired a lobbyist and traveled to Washington annually to support earmarks for the town totaling $27 million. In her two years as governor, Alaska has requested nearly $750 million in special federal spending, by far the largest per-capita request in the nation. While Palin notes she rejected plans to build a $398 million bridge from Ketchikan to an island with 50 residents and an airport, that opposition came only after the plan was ridiculed nationally as a "bridge to nowhere."

    So, basically, as a mayor and governor, she did exactly what her job was in terms of trying to get as much FEDERAL money for her constituency as possible. For those jobs, she did the exact right thing--if it didn't go to her people, it would have gone to other people. (As a mayor, she was effective at getting $27MM for her constituency. As a Governor, she was effective at getting $750MM for her constituency. That's exactly what one would hope for an expect from a mayor and governor. They aren't the ones responsible for trimming and containing the federal budget; they are the ones trying to get some of their constituency's money BACK.)

    In terms of "vetoing" wasteful spending...again, right, she did: she vetoed wasteful spending of ALASKAN tax dollars--again, her job. I would cite this, too, if I were her--it shows how she manages her responsibilities in an executive office. She never said that she vetoed wasteful CONGRESSIONAL spending. How could she? Not her job, beyond her authority, and against her constituency's interest (where her obligation was), if spending would mean money to her home.

    On the bridge thing: she determined that she didn't want the bridge when she realized it was silly, a waste of money, and not in her constituency's best interests to seek. Again, making this determination on behalf of her constituency was her job. If she wants to paint it now as though she did it because she thought that she had some obligation to reign in Congress, that's just silly. Preventing wasteful spending by Congress was not her job. The only reason she should have turned down the birdge project is if it wasn't good for her constituency. Which, apparently, she did.

    The fact that she actually made this determination is what is surprising to me. As long as she didn't screw over her constituency by rejecting the opportunity to bring the money for the bridge to her state, then there's no problem. I guess someone could argue that she walked away from the bridge project to help her own caree down the line--to look like a fiscal conservative. I'm not really seeing that, and I am a total cynic. First, walking away from that project completely pissed off her own party in her home state. Plus, would any reasonable, sane person have thought that she had real hopes for national scale political office?


    PALIN: "The Democratic nominee for president supports plans to raise income taxes, raise payroll taxes, raise investment income taxes, raise the death tax, raise business taxes, and increase the tax burden on the American people by hundreds of billions of dollars."

    THE FACTS: The Tax Policy Center, a think tank run jointly by the Brookings Institution and the Urban Institute, concluded that Obama's plan would increase after-tax income for middle-income taxpayers by about 5 percent by 2012, or nearly $2,200 annually. McCain's plan, which cuts taxes across all income levels, would raise after tax-income for middle-income taxpayers by 3 percent, the center concluded.

    Obama would provide $80 billion in tax breaks, mainly for poor workers and the elderly, including tripling the Earned Income Tax Credit for minimum-wage workers and higher credits for larger families.

    He also would raise income taxes, capital gains and dividend taxes on the wealthiest. He would raise payroll taxes on taxpayers with incomes above $250,000, and he would raise corporate taxes. Small businesses that make more than $250,000 a year would see taxes rise.

    Personally, I am so tired of this back and forth on the Obama tax plan. Focusing whether he will raise or lower the individual's tax liability is terribly shortsighted. The much more important point is that he wants to raise taxes on corporations--which he proudly admits and endorses. People act as if this means that the "big bad guys" will be picking up a bigger share and this will cut a big break for everyone else. That's not the way it works. When publicly held corporations are more heavily taxed, the average Joe suffers. Costs go up, dividends go down, and corporate growth and value stagnate. That hurts the pocketbook of the ordinary consumer on the front end (immediate consumer costs) and in the longer run (who owns the shares in publicly held corporations? The public...as in retirement accounts and pension funds). Plus, in a non-tax-advantaged vehicle context, it de-incentivizes savings and investing because it raises taxes on capital investments.

    Also, it should be noted that the two institutes that provided the analysis are generally regarded as very liberal.


    FORMER ARKANSAS GOV. MIKE HUCKABEE: Palin "got more votes running for mayor of Wasilla, Alaska than Joe Biden got running for president of the United States."

    THE FACTS: A whopper. Palin got 616 votes in the 1996 mayor's election, and got 909 in her 1999 re-election race, for a total of 1,525. Biden dropped out of the race after the Iowa caucuses, but he still got 76,165 votes in 23 states and the District of Columbia where he was on the ballot during the 2008 presidential primaries.

    Best guess, he was talking about percentages, not raw vote numbers. You may not like Huckabee, but he's not an idiot. ANyhow, if that's the case, then he is correct.

    FORMER MASSACHUSETTS GOV. MITT ROMNEY: "We need change, all right — change from a liberal Washington to a conservative Washington! We have a prescription for every American who wants change in Washington — throw out the big-government liberals, and elect John McCain and Sarah Palin."

    THE FACTS: A Back-to-the-Future moment. George W. Bush, a conservative Republican, has been president for nearly eight years. And until last year, Republicans controlled Congress. Only since January 2007 have Democrats have been in charge of the House and Senate.

    I suspect Romney was referring to two steps, not one: that is, throw out the liberals (in Congress) AND elect McCain/Palin...not throw out the liberals BY throwing out Bush/Cheney. But, that being said, I would NOT argue with the assertion that Bush is, at times, a big-government liberal...at least in terms of fiscal policy!!

    Comment


    • #47
      Re: Palin's Speech

      The Bridge to Nowhere story is spin at its finest. Alaska still took much of the money - over 200 million of the original 350 million or so. Congress (not Alaskan government officials) changed the wording in the appropriation after so much scandal resulted from the "Bridge to Nowhere" stories. (I'm assuming everyone is familiar with the pork project.) The money was now free to be used on transportation projects as Alaska saw fit. The money was used (spent, taken, gone) in Alaska - just not on the Bridge. When the bridge project was up for re-assessment and the federal funds originally earmarked for it had been mostly spent on either items, Palin killed the project. Why wouldn't she? She no longer had the funding. She (or those before her) had spent 2/3 of the FEDERAL dollars. So, the idea that she turned down the money and saved it for the USA is mostly spin. She took the cash and didn't build the bridge. :huh: I don't mind that she made better use of the funding but it is misleading to say that she turned the funds down because it was wasteful. She didn't turn down the money. Also, it was Congress that released the attachment of the funding to the Bridge project - not Palin. So, they said "No thanks...if Alaska needs a Bridge they can spend their own budget money on it" . Palin did not say "No thanks, if we need a bridge we will build it ourselves." Misleading.

      She determined that she didn't want the bridge when she realized it was silly, a waste of money, and not in her constituency's best interests to seek. The fact that she actually made this determination is what is surprising to me. As a governor, it wasn't her job to turn DOWN money for her state or be the guardian against wasteful FEDERAL government spending.
      This is your take. I think it isn't entirely accurate since Alaska still took the money; they just used it for more appropriate projects. That was a good government decision. Why not just tell the whole story? She didn't build the bridge because she used the money elsewhere. That's not saving the Federal goverment money to the extent that she implied.

      Also, she campaigned on the idea that she supported the Bridge. She went before the city council of the town in question and stated that the bridge would be built. So....she backed off that after she was elected. I can buy that she learned more later that changed her mind, but again....misleading.
      Angie
      Gyn-Onc fellowship survivor - 10 years out of the training years; reluctant suburbanite
      Mom to DS (18) and DD (15) (and many many pets)

      "Where are we going - and what am I doing in this handbasket?"

      Comment


      • #48
        Re: Palin's Speech

        Originally posted by Sheherezade
        The Bridge to Nowhere story is spin at its finest. Alaska still took much of the money - over 200 million of the original 350 million or so. Congress (not Alaskan government officials) changed the wording in the appropriation after so much scandal resulted from the "Bridge to Nowhere" stories. (I'm assuming everyone is familiar with the pork project.) The money was now free to be used on transportation projects as Alaska saw fit. The money was used (spent, taken, gone) in Alaska - just not on the Bridge. When the bridge project was up for re-assessment and the federal funds originally earmarked for it had been mostly spent on either items, Palin killed the project. Why wouldn't she? She no longer had the funding. She (or those before her) had spent 2/3 of the FEDERAL dollars. So, the idea that she turned down the money and saved it for the USA is mostly spin. She took the cash and didn't build the bridge. :huh: I don't mind that she made better use of the funding but it is misleading to say that she turned the funds down because it was wasteful. She didn't turn down the money. Also, it was Congress that released the attachment of the funding to the Bridge project - not Palin. So, they said "No thanks...if Alaska needs a Bridge they can spend their own budget money on it" . Palin did not say "No thanks, if we need a bridge we will build it ourselves." Misleading.

        She determined that she didn't want the bridge when she realized it was silly, a waste of money, and not in her constituency's best interests to seek. The fact that she actually made this determination is what is surprising to me. As a governor, it wasn't her job to turn DOWN money for her state or be the guardian against wasteful FEDERAL government spending.
        This is your take. I think it isn't entirely accurate since Alaska still took the money; they just used it for more appropriate projects. That was a good government decision. Why not just tell the whole story? She didn't build the bridge because she used the money elsewhere. That's not saving the Federal goverment money to the extent that she implied.

        Also, she campaigned on the idea that she supported the Bridge. She went before the city council of the town in question and stated that the bridge would be built. So....she backed off that after she was elected. I can buy that she learned more later that changed her mind, but again....misleading.
        Even better in her role as a Governor! She got the money AND didn't throw it away on a stupid project!

        In my original post, I realized that I'd failed to concede that she may be, uh, "re-framing" the reason for her position on the bridge (now trying to suggest that she was somehow protecting Congressional spending from wastefulness), so I edited the post. I think we were ships passing in the night...by the time I posted, you'd posted back. Sorry about that! I certainly agree with the assessment that the McCain camp is spinning her bridge position. My only point is: given her actual job, she did nothing wrong...in fact, she did everything right, for her constituents at the time.

        Comment


        • #49
          Re: Palin's Speech

          I'll have to go back a re-read your edits. I think Palin does a good job in the job she is assigned. I'm just not hopeful that as my vp or president she will feel that it is her job to represent ALL US citizens - not just Republicans. For example, if she were to look at data that suggests that over 50% of the population believes that some form of abortion should be available, would she act accordingly as the representative of the majority? Or would she be true to her positions when elected as half of a ticket? After being overlooked for years by the Bush administration, I have little faith that the president wants to represent Americans. They just want to please their half of the Americans. I wonder if her record of "doing her elected job" even if it requires her to change positions on issues like the Bridge would continue.

          Here's a better explanation of the Bridge by an actual writer:

          Palin formally nixed plans for a nearly $400-million Alaska bridge project to connect the tiny city of Ketchikan to Gravina, an island with just a few dozen residents and an airport. The project was derisively nicknamed the Bridge to Nowhere by a government watchdog group and became a national symbol of federal pork-barrel spending.

          Long before Palin killed the project, Congress washed its hands of the bridge. In the transportation spending bill that included money for the Ketchikan bridge, Congress deleted the wording that would have directed money for the project, though it left the money in place so Alaska officials could decide which transportation projects to spend it on. As a result, Alaska diverted much of the $223-million from the federal government to other projects, leaving the Ketchikan-Gravina bridge project woefully underfunded, and with no prospect of additional federal funding. That was the point at which Palin formally killed the bridge project.
          Angie
          Gyn-Onc fellowship survivor - 10 years out of the training years; reluctant suburbanite
          Mom to DS (18) and DD (15) (and many many pets)

          "Where are we going - and what am I doing in this handbasket?"

          Comment


          • #50
            Re: Palin's Speech

            Originally posted by Sheherezade
            I'm just not hopeful that as my vp or president she will feel that it is her job to represent ALL US citizens - not just Republicans. For example, if she were to look at data that suggests that over 50% of the population believes that some form of abortion should be available, would she act accordingly as the representative of the majority? Or would she be true to her positions when elected as half of a ticket?
            She will represent all Americans but she won't represent (nor advocate for) all views of Americans. No elected officlal can. Obama will represent me, but he certainly won't represent my views. But, that is what happens in a democracy--sometimes you're in the minority.

            I would argue that her job is not to rubberstamp what the public wants on any one issue at any particular time. It is to consider what is in the best interests of her constituency and act accordingly. However, that must include LISTENING to your constituency (!! one would hope!!) as well as using your own judgment and practical experience. However, just because 60% of your constituency wants "X," that doesn't necessarily obligate you to seek that if you don't believe that position--for whatever reason--is in the best interests of your constituency. And, of course, you are completely accountable to your constituency--if you DON'T act in a way that they want, they will throw you out of office!

            But I think it's a fine line to walk. At the end of the day, I personally think that you should defer to your constituency and assume that they take positions that ARE in their own best interests. For example, if you were elected as a pro-life candidate, but your constituency changes and becomes pro-choice, and there is tremendous pressure for you to then vote a pro-choice position on some legislation, maybe you should consider resigning your position instead of substituting your judgment for theirs. If you seriously disagree with most of the people you represent, perhaps you shouldn't be representing them and usurping their voice.

            Comment


            • #51
              Re: Palin's Speech

              Something I found out over the last few days of researching many things:

              Barack Obama and Joe Biden both voted for the "Bridge to Nowhere" funding. I guess it was one of the few times Obama didn't vote "Present".

              Until a day or so ago Alaska's Democratic Party website credited Governor Palin for nixing the "Bridge to Nowhere". That page was taken down recently - apparently it doesn't jibe with the party line.
              Who uses a machete to cut through red tape
              With fingernails that shine like justice
              And a voice that is dark like tinted glass

              Comment


              • #52
                Re: Palin's Speech

                Originally posted by Rapunzel
                I guess it was one of the few times Obama didn't vote "Present". .
                He never voted "present" in the US Senate. "Present" was an option in the Illinois State House.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Re: Palin's Speech

                  Hey gang, if you want to hear Palin answer questions rather then talk from script an interview she is doing (did?) with Charles Gibson is going to start airing tomorrow night (Thursday) on the abc 5:30pm CT (6:30 ET) news. I don't usually watch the abc evening news but I'll be tuning in for that.
                  Wife to NSG out of training, mom to 2, 10 & 8, and a beagle with wings.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Re: Palin's Speech

                    This is her first interview - besides the People magazine spread. It's been kind of a big deal in the political talk shows because no one has been granted access to ask her questions until this. (Apparently, she hasn't even taken questions from people in town hall like settings yet with McCain.) I think it is an honor for Gibson to have been chosen. ABC said that they (ABC) declared no topic off limits and that she was available to him for two days in Alaska. He's been prepping for it all week. I'm not familiar with Gibson (much) but from what I've heard he is a kind and balanced reporter. I'm looking forward to seeing it!

                    I thought that the Newsweek spread on Palin was fairly balanced. Not that I'm following this story or anything....
                    Angie
                    Gyn-Onc fellowship survivor - 10 years out of the training years; reluctant suburbanite
                    Mom to DS (18) and DD (15) (and many many pets)

                    "Where are we going - and what am I doing in this handbasket?"

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Re: Palin's Speech

                      So it hasn't been done yet? I believe I heard that she is headed back to Alaska today b/c her son is leaving tomorrow, so they're going to do the interview there after he leaves? I'm very interested to see it.
                      Wife to NSG out of training, mom to 2, 10 & 8, and a beagle with wings.

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Re: Palin's Speech

                        So did anyone see the first part of her interview on the abc nightly news? Today's topic was foreign affairs/war and while she answered most of the questions I thought there were definitely a few that she was ducking.

                        You can see a clip here: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2...5778018&page=1

                        and you can read the transcript here: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2...5782924&page=1

                        I think this is the topic she probably has the least amount of experience with so it was interesting that they chose to do this first. There will be more tomorrow night and then even more on tomorrow night's 20/20. I thought Charlie did a good job.
                        Wife to NSG out of training, mom to 2, 10 & 8, and a beagle with wings.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Re: Palin's Speech

                          Thank you!!!
                          Angie
                          Gyn-Onc fellowship survivor - 10 years out of the training years; reluctant suburbanite
                          Mom to DS (18) and DD (15) (and many many pets)

                          "Where are we going - and what am I doing in this handbasket?"

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Re: Palin's Speech

                            What's up Chuck?



                            GOP senator: A 'stretch' to say Palin is qualified 1 hour, 23 minutes ago



                            Nebraska Republican Sen. Chuck Hagel said his party's vice presidential nominee, Sarah Palin, lacks foreign policy experience and called it a "stretch" to say she's qualified to be president.

                            "She doesn't have any foreign policy credentials," Hagel said in an interview published Thursday by the Omaha World-Herald. "You get a passport for the first time in your life last year? I mean, I don't know what you can say. You can't say anything."

                            Could Palin lead the country if GOP presidential nominee John McCain could not?

                            "I think it's a stretch to, in any way, to say that she's got the experience to be president of the United States," Hagel said.

                            McCain and other Republicans have defended Palin's qualifications, citing Alaska's proximity to Russia. Palin told ABC News, "They're our next-door neighbors and you can actually see Russia from land here in Alaska, from an island in Alaska."

                            Hagel took issue with that argument. "I think they ought to be just honest about it and stop the nonsense about, 'I look out my window and I see Russia and so therefore I know something about Russia,'" he said. "That kind of thing is insulting to the American people."

                            Hagel, a senior member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, has been a vocal critic of the Bush administration since the 2003 invasion of Iraq.

                            In July, Hagel traveled to Iraq and Afghanistan with Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama. Though he didn't expect to be asked, Hagel had said he would have considered serving as Obama's running mate.

                            Palin was mayor of Wasilla, Alaska, population 6,500, before becoming Alaska's governor in December 2006.

                            Palin visited soldiers in Kuwait and Germany last year and said in an interview with ABC News that her only other foreign travel had been to Mexico and Canada. She also said she had never met a foreign head of state.

                            Hagel told the newspaper that other governors have been elected to serve in the White House without experience in Washington. He said judgment and character were also important for the job.

                            "But I do think in a world that is so complicated, so interconnected and so combustible, you really got to have some people in charge that have some sense of the bigger scope of the world," Hagel said. "I think that's just a requirement."

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Re: Palin's Speech

                              Originally posted by LilySayWhat
                              Had McCain selected Hagel as a running mate, I would have serious doubts about which way to cast my vote. I really like Hagel and have for years.

                              I agree Lily. I think a lot of people are thinking the exact same thing.
                              HOW could he have chosen HER? I'm just .
                              Flynn

                              Wife to post training CT surgeon; mother of three kids ages 17, 15, and 11.

                              “It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities.” —Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets " Albus Dumbledore

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Re: Palin's Speech

                                Originally posted by Flynn
                                Originally posted by LilySayWhat
                                Had McCain selected Hagel as a running mate, I would have serious doubts about which way to cast my vote. I really like Hagel and have for years.

                                I agree Lily. I think a lot of people are thinking the exact same thing.
                                HOW could he have chosen HER? I'm just .

                                I think that the scratching heads can be applied to both veeps. I mean, with the awful economy that we are apparently facing we have Joe Biden - who passed bankruptcy legislation the credit card companies pushed for and whose son is a lobbyist for the credit card industry. :huh: Talk about a really awful choice in the current climate!

                                Gah. I actually dislike all of them - strongly.
                                Who uses a machete to cut through red tape
                                With fingernails that shine like justice
                                And a voice that is dark like tinted glass

                                Comment

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