How do you feel about the bailout?

[PrincessFiona]

700 billion and still rising. (Now it appears that the politicians are trying to tack on special projects to the rescue bill because they know it has to pass.)

I'm prepared to live through another great depression to make sure that the free market in this capitalist society gets to speak. I just am not ok with the idea of bailing out these corporations who knowingly took huge risks, blew it and then are walking away with multi-million dollar bonuses while people lose their retirements (my mom has lost 40k of her 100k...no retiring next year!), are stuck with homes that have lost their value or with mortgages that they can't pay. Our home has gone down in value by nearly 30% if you consider the comps in our neighborhood right now. We have 3 foreclosures out of 40 homes...and one of the homes was owned by the MN State GOVT for use as a halfway house. So...the state of MN is getting away with non-payment and foreclosure? :huh:

I want blood. I feel like I won't cast my vote for any politician that comes out in support of this...even if that means I vote 3rd party this time. I think this bailout is crazy.

What could we have for 700 billion?

Universal healthcare.
Living wages.
Free Universities?

[rainbabies]

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

i don't know much about it, but i don't think i like it.

why should we (?) have to pay for banks/mortgage companies and people who made a bad decision? it's not MY fault that someone who makes $45,000/year bought a house for $400,000 and cannot make the payments. or racked up thousands and thousands on CC's...and now cannot make minimum payments. the people who took out the loans and CC's along with the lenders should just eat it and deal.

WTH? i can't blame anyone for the way dh and i used our CC's to get thru residency. it's our responsibility. not the govts. so, we will just keep making minimum payments until we're done with this hell.

i think it sucks, and that maybe the economy needs to have this happen w/o govt. help. sounds to me that we're headed for a socialist nation. :huh:

[Sheherezade]

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

I'm angered by the bailouts - but I do understand the need to act if the fall out will land on all of us (good choices or no). Still, I am hearing that the proposal to Congress was a three page document and that no oversight was planned for the Treasury Secretary. I am NOT OK with that under any circumstances. I know it is a rush deal, but jeez. I had to turn in a 20 page document with all possibilities explored to get $3500 for a crossing guard program. Maybe I should have asked for 700 billion and claimed that people's children would be eaten alive if they didn't give it to me TODAY. They need to do something but they need to discuss this, get multiple opinions and work towards a solution that works for as many parties as possible.

BTW, I heard this morning that in the Japan real estate bubble pop, prices dropped 85% at the bottom.

Fun times. My generational time slot is sooooooo icky.

ETA: I'm thinking that smart people would be good -- but my faith in "smart" in the financial sector is waning. I'm thinking greed has overwhelmed smart there and some of these players are right out of college/business school people that road the wave of good times. I'm not sure they are as "smart" as we've been thinking. Maybe they have just been lucky.....

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

It scares me. I've been reading about it - but it's truly all so far above my head it just makes my brain swim. I see / agree with the "why should we bail out these private sector companies while their CEO's walk away with multi-million dollar golden parachutes?", but I also hear/understand that these things will trickle down to US. It's not just the people who took out an unreasonable mortgage who will be affected - it's you and me. It's not just the people who lived on their credit cards who will be affected (and we did, but thankfully aren't there now), it's even the responsible user who holds their cards in their wallet for an emergency. If these banks can't operate - then they (from what I gather) might just have to shut down. No more mortgages, and your rainy-day credit card just might not work.

I am inscensed to think that this might just be a "no-strings" bailout -- as Paulson has been quoted as requesting. At the VERY least we should have oversight if we're essentially buying the damn companies.

I can't blame the politicians for working to fix this at this point. I think it's easy to say we can live through another Great Depression when we weren't A) there the first time to see the devastation, and B) are blessed enough to be in a livelihood that will continue even through a depression. I DO blame the rampant deregulation that has gotten us to this point -- and the politicians who played a part in that.

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

I don't have a solid opinion on any of this, just because I don't know enough about Big Finance to really understand it.

I think that most of the population is in this category, myself included. That's probably why we haven't seen that much finger-pointing between the democrats and republicans. Is it fair to blame George Bush and his administration? He has wreaked so much havoc on this country, can we just add this mess to his pile?

I'm not happy about the bailout. I think that someone should be held accountable...at least confiscate the giant bonuses...something.




I feel the need to hoard dried food and cash.

[PrincessFiona]

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

If we are going to bail them out, then lets just call it what it is and...nationalize our banks.

You know that these big banks/credit agencies will get back on their feet thanks to the money that WE, the tax payers (and by that, I do really mean us...because we pay a higher percentage of our taxes and get the least for that money!) will give them. Then, they will be in it for themselves again....no one will care about our retirement, home values or paying for our children's college education.

You want me to bail out these asswipes? Guarantee free college for my kids!

We do see business in the medical industry suffering here now, btw. There are less elective surgeries, less people going in for regular check-ups, etc. There was just a big meeting about it here last week. Maybe this hasn't affected the larger metropolitan areas, but people with less money don't want to pay co-pays, can't afford to meet their deductibles etc.

No more coffee for me this am.

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

We do see business in the medical industry suffering here now, btw. There are less elective surgeries, less people going in for regular check-ups, etc.

I was just discussing this with my step-mom this weekend. She's a recovery room rn and she said their cases have been waaaay down lately. How bad must it be when people who DO have insurance can't afford healthcare?

[Sheherezade]

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

I think we should all write our Congressmen and Senators now. Seriously. I know this is going to happen - but they need to feel the pressure of the people to look out for OUR interests in this and not just the interests of the Wall Streeters.

[PrincessFiona]

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

I agree, Angie. And hey...if they are going to write in little extra projects, I'm going to add in my demands for universal health care and free college for my kids.

[Sheherezade]

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

Yeah....it is depressing to realize that the government works much the same as a lazy individual with too much money/credit. We can't commit to 700 billion dollars to finance healthcare or college education. Too Expensive!! Now, in a crisis, we pass the spending amount in a few days with little discussion because we have no choice.

This sounds exactly like what DH and I went through with a crappy old car in training. We could never commit to buying a new one because we didn't want to take on the debt or save the money by cutting back....but we ended up spending close to 6 K fixing the sucker every time it broke down and left us stranded somewhere. :huh: Bad planning. Bad investment.

Is it wrong that I expect better from trained professionals?

[houseelf]

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

I feel the need to hoard dried food and cash.

I *really* hate that I'm feeling so down about the future, but honest-to-goodness am at a place where I'm having a hard time envisioning a better future for the next generation. (I really hate that cynicism is so much easier than hope, but there it is). I keep thinking about the midcentury Germans carting their cash around in wheelbarrows because their currency had lost so much value. All that has happened recently coupled with the fact that this country is seriously overleveraged vis a vis treasury bonds makes me wake up in cold sweats.

Kelly

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

This is a tough one. I have not read enough to have anything but a gut reaction, which is I don't want to bail anyone out of anything.

From a purely emotional standpoint:
You made $40K a year and thought you could afford a $350K house with some crazy interest only no-money down mortgage and now you can't pay? I'm sorry, you do not deserve anything.
You needed a plasma TV and an Ipod and you are maxed out on credit cards because you spent money you didn't have on stupid toys? You do not deserve anything.
You use credit like monopoly money and don't understand you have to pay it all back? You do not deserve anything.

It sucks because from a gut standpoint, it seems like those who "did the right thing" saved for what they wanted, pay for what they own are getting screwed and that makes my head want to explode.

What happened to personal responsibility? I completely understand the blame heading to Wall Street for a cut and run CEO with a golden parachute. But I think the finger can be pointed right back to many Main Street Americans. We have become a very bloated, self-entitled people. The correction needs to be in the market as well as with the average American.

As much as this might need to be done to protect us all - what message does this bailout send? Does it make it all okay? Is there a way to preserve the market to avoid total collapse while still holding people personally responsible? I don't know.

I will be even more pissed off if they make it a "Christmas Tree" bill with all sorts of extra crap.

this is my biggest concern right now. I see this as another Patriot Act in the making.

We can't commit to 700 billion dollars to finance healthcare or college education. Too Expensive!! Now, in a crisis, we pass the spending amount in a few days with little discussion because we have no choice.

Totally agree!!

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

I completely agree. If there is suddenly excess money to throw around surely the priotities should be healthcare and education and about a thousand other things before these bailouts?

[PrincessFiona]

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

Oh, and the dem push to cap salaries makes me nervous. I understand wanting to serve up someone's head on a silver platter to the american public, but capping salaries is also discussed uncomfortably frequently in health care reform too. It's just a few steps away from ourselves. I don't think we should go down that road. If an institute is paying their CEOs too much their business will suffer and let's face it they will still get it...somehow. It would just be a public show with no real change. But allowing angry people with pitch forks and torches to start a salary capping vendetta makes me uncomfortable. It could very well end up on our own front doors.

OK...see that doesn't make me nervous at all, even given that it could happen in our industry. You say that if an institute is paying their CEOs too much their business will suffer and ultimately they will get it...somehow.

HOW?

If we, the people, bail them out, they won't. They should all go down and this should be a lesson to the big companies and CEOs!

Our children will be paying the tab on this too. What exactly will be their for our kids.

If the job of our govt. is to protect the people, where is universal healthcare for those who can't get private insurance? Why aren't college educations affordable? Does protecting the pople only apply to letting them own guns and earn an unlimited sum if they are big wig CEO? :huh:

Kris

Re: How do you feel about the bailout?

ITA with Annie.

Salary caps should come from shareholder pressure and not government mandates. I think CEOs make WAY too much money and get to walk away from the train crash with buckets of cash. That should change but what is "fair" compensation? Unless there was some rule about salary not being able to exceed a certain...something...some sort of balance sheet figure...even then I don't think it would be such a hot idea.

I also think this bailout is necessary. Painful, but necessary. If it didn't happen, I think we would have a whole lot more to worry about than the current number of uninsured or college tuition. This mess should have never happened in the first place. I'm not comfortable with the lack of oversight for the Treasury dept because someone should have raised some warnings about this beforehand. Treasury? SEC? Federal Reserve? Anybody? Six months ago I was hearing about the potential problems of un-regulated credit swapping and the lack of capital to support it and its not like I have an inside track on this.

Excessive credit led to excess on the parts of lenders and borrowers and now we all have to pay for it. Like Jenn said, this isn't just a CEO getting gobs of money or even the person with the bad mortgage getting bailed out -- they aren't operating in a bubble where they are the only ones benefiting. It matters to everyone. I hope they aren't able to tack on a whole lot more stuff to this bill (wankers) and keep a narrow focus. I think the S&L crisis in the 80s ended up costing less than original expected (some offset by selling mortgages at a discount).