Wondered how everyone would view this situation

[Sheherezade]

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...d?sc=17&f=1001

All I can think about is if it was my daughter in that hospital bed losing my grandchild. Tragic.

I think this story highlights why abortion laws need flexibility. Ohio is considering a heart beat law now. Would passing it make things like this more likely - or would federal protections still allow doctors the ability to treat a patient as they see fit?

Perhaps they should have had her transferred to a hospital in the UK. Maybe she would have survived.

[SoonerTexan]

Treading softly here. I don't know if I'm up for another discussion on this topic so soon. But since I'm never at a loss for words : I see it as a sad tragedy that has been seized upon to make a political point. What happened (from the little we really know) was not in line with Catholic teaching or potentially even the laws of Ireland and I think we should save the pitchforks until it is known what exactly happened.

I'm pretty much in line with this:

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/yimcath...appanavar.html

[Sheherezade]

I was wondering if this event went according to law or if it went wrong somehow. It seems like a situation most wouldn't want to happen.

[alison]

My view is that if the woman's life could have been saved, then an abortion is the right thing to do. I believe this happened recently in the Dominican Republic where abortions are also not legal. So sad that two lives are lost in these instances.

[Sheherezade]

From the article you posted: "Abortion is illegal in the Republic except where there is a real and substantial risk to the life, as distinct from the health, of the mother."

This was mentioned in other articles I read seeming to suggest that doctors judged that the mothers "health" but not her "life" was at risk and thus termination was not an option. I'd imagine that there are times in which a doctor would make the call that it was not life and death and have it turn out to be... And vice versa.

I don't consider my reaction to this story to be "activism disguised as compassion or moral outrage" though. I hope the author of the piece realizes that there are people out there that actually feel for this poor woman.

I had the same thing happen to my third pregnancy at about the same stage. Luckily, I guess, there was no fetal heartbeat. They did a D and C after 4 dats to prevent infection and to save me from the horror of walking around any longer carrying a dead child. I guess that's why this story hits so close to home.

[weeniegeniewife]

I had the same thing happen to my third pregnancy at about the same stage. Luckily, I guess, there was no fetal heartbeat. They did a D and C after 4 dats to prevent infection and to save me from the horror of walking around any longer carrying a dead child. I guess that's why this story hits so close to home.

I am sorry for your loss. A similar thing happened to me and I am so thankful for having the options I did.

[SoonerTexan]

I don't consider my reaction to this story to be "activism disguised as compassion or moral outrage" though. I hope the author of the piece realizes that there are people out there that actually feel for this poor woman.

I don't either. I read it and felt awful. But there are quite a few media outlets that have been reporting it with a definite anti-Catholic "see what happens because of your stupid Church and stupid rules" and I don't think that is fair. I think the article I posted is responding to that.

I am sorry for your loss.

And this. That is hard. And that is part of the reason I hate discussing this here. It hits very close to home for so many people.

[McPants]

This event made me ashamed to have lived on the island of Ireland.

[bobk]

The Supreme Court ruling sounds reasonable to me, however the reality of enforcing that is difficult. Even our best and most experienced doctors don't always know when death is imminent. There are always medical situations that unexpectedly improve or deteriorate. I'm in favor of giving doctors more leeway, provided there is considerable oversight of these cases.

[PrincessFiona]

The ability to legislate and enforce exceptions to abortion law is what makes me pro-choice. I lived in N. Ireland and some of their morality was def. influenced by the Catholic irish in the South.

Frankly, this is what pro-life looks like. If you are a resident of S. Dakota for example this might be you. If it isn't palatable to you perhaps you rethink your views. Perhaps not.

Kris

[GrayMatterWife]

As someone who has seen medicine up-close-and-personal in the Rep of Ireland and how it is practiced, I am sure there is a LOT more to this story. The only reason that this woman's death made the news is because it involved the abortion issue. What should shock the conscience is the commonness of unnecessary death that is a direct result of the way medicine is practiced and managed. My husband saw it all.the.time. People died for zero reason other than the system.

[McPants]

As someone who has seen medicine up-close-and-personal in the Rep of Ireland and how it is practiced, I am sure there is a LOT more to this story. The only reason that this woman's death made the news is because it involved the abortion issue. What should shock the conscience is the commonness of unnecessary death that is a direct result of the way medicine is practiced and managed. My husband saw it all.the.time. People died for zero reason other than the system.

From what I've read, in this case the medical staff was apparently very reluctant to act due to the imprecise nature of the religiously derived law and the severity of punishment involved if medical staff would have been adjudged to have acted against it.

[GrayMatterWife]

From what I've read, in this case the medical staff was apparently very reluctant to act due to the imprecise nature of the religiously derived law and the severity of punishment involved if medical staff would have been adjudged to have acted against it.

I wouldn't be surprised. The entire system is insane with by imprecise, poorly written laws on many fronts. It is paralyzing. It is better that someone dies than anyone risk the punishment of doing something that would allow them to live but might run afoul of the rules. Total nightmare.

[Meenah]

Angie, I feel your pain, I had the same happen with my first pregnancy at 11 weeks. I usually shy away from these threads.

[GrayMatterWife]

Frankly, this is what pro-life looks like. If you are a resident of S. Dakota for example this might be you.

I don't think this is accurate. This is what incredibly sh*tty Irish law complicated by bureaucratic fear looks like. No one I know who is pro-life would sanction the death of the mother. At least, no one who is remotely intellectually consistent. Pro-life is not just pro-life of the baby. Abortion when the mother will otherwise die is not a position inconsistent with being pro-life.

There is a moral difference between intentional killing and incidental killing. If an abortion is necessary to save the life of the mother, the result of the abortion is incidental.

And, in the situation of a baby that died in utero, it's not even an abortion to remove the tissue--an abortion, by definition, is the termination of a pregnancy. You are not pregnant if the child is dead. You are post-pregnant...and at a very high risk of infection.

This whole thing is heartbreaking.