Solving the education crisis in America

Esther,

When I'm lecturing I usually have a separate conversation going on in my head that sounds like this "oh, goood one....you said that really clearly...NOT...relax....oh no...is my face turning red..it IS...stop turning red...take a deep breath...."

kris

I do that too! If only you could have heard my internal monologue during my job interview on Thursday... sigh...

[PrincessFiona]

It's awful, isn't it Esther? I wish they made a medication for that I find it to be very distracting. I think it is why I do so much better in small groups. I don't get as nervous and I'm so busy actually showing the kids something that I forget to have those inner dialogues!

How was your job interview??

kris

Kris, I'm really not sure how it went. I met with 5 people (individually) one day and then a 6th person the next (it was a long interview process!) I definitely found it easier to talk to some of the interviewers than others, so it's hard for me to guess what kind of overall impression I made. I will post a note if I get an offer; I've been out of work for 4 months now (!) and it's been really hard to get interviews. It would definitely be a relief to find a job, but I'm also nervous about it. I always get scared starting something new, with a whole new group of people.

[Rapunzel]

Flynn, I do think that a teaching certificate serves the purpose of being the benchmark for accepting applicants for the job of teaching in a government school and some private schools (and stated so in my post). I completely understand that.

I do think there is a misconception in our culture that one has to have a teaching certificate in order to be able to teach children - period (including one's own children - apparently there are a number of lawmakers in our nation who buy into that idea). I was primarily commenting on that particular cultural phenomenon.

The above misconception is often found hand-in-hand with the idea that "Teaching" requires that one have a particular education or training. It creates the idea that a teacher is a seperate subset requiring specialized skills that can't be found in the "average" human being. I pointed out that all normal loving parents are inate teachers to counter that additional flawed idea found in our culture.

Perhaps I should elaborate on what I said about "teaching" being "easy". I think that the word I actually should have used was "natural". Of course, what is natural may not always be seen as easy (breastfeeding is natural and often not easy for new mothers). So, I definitely misspoke when I used that word - I was in the middle of a heavy-vomiting day, though, and I tend to make mistakes on my bad days.

I find teaching to be easy. I think it has more to do with my attitude towards it than anything else. I regard it as entirely natural - not something that has to be forced. I believe all human beings want to learn. You just have to figure out the right type of encouragement and the right kind of example to give. I've taught former gang members, children of pimps and prostitutes, kids with mental illnesses, etc. I didn't find it difficult to teach them. The first thing I did was learn to care about each of those kids as individuals. Then I could start learning for myself what types of encouragement and examples they needed individually. Yes, I believe a good teacher is one that is teachable him/herself. I am willing to learn from those I teach, love them, and regard the entire learning process as a natural one.

I have never had any formal training in teaching. But, I have had the opportunity to teach elementary children (other than my own) how to read, classes on parenting and marriage to women (many older than myself), inner-city teens, and, of course, my own children. My experiences have shown me that it is really not about training but, rather, about attitude. I didn't get that across very well a few days ago.

Jennifer

[Meenah]

I prefer my teachers to have education and certificates!!!! We have 4 kids, all in college and doing well (the oldest just graduated from Harvard and is now in graduate school in Scotland). I must say in my own humble opinion I could not have taught any of them better than they were taught in school, and I am college educated, but can't teach at all.
Luanne

[fluffhead]

Sorry to hijack the thread, Luanne, but grad school in Scotland??? That's so cool! Where is he? What is he studying? Why Scotland?

[Meenah]

She is in Glasgow doing a Masters program in International Business. She will be done in September. She loves Scotland. In her Junior year at Harvard she went to St. Andrews and loved it. She is my husband's oldest. We hope to go and visit her in the Spring if we can afford it!!
Luanne

[Rapunzel]

I prefer my teachers to have education and certificates!!!! We have 4 kids, all in college and doing well (the oldest just graduated from Harvard and is now in graduate school in Scotland). I must say in my own humble opinion I could not have taught any of them better than they were taught in school, and I am college educated, but can't teach at all.
Luanne

If you didn't have the desire to teach them, then most certainly yes, someone else with that desire could have and would have done the job better than yourself. The certificate means only that the person has learned crowd control techniques (highly necessary for public schools that pack the kids in tight), the latest philosophies on how children might learn (although that information is readily available to all who seek it beyond a classroom), and perhaps a bit of specific psychological information on the age-group they are seeking to teach professionally. I know this from my own sister and mother-in-law (both teachers who have detailed to me their teaching certificate courses - and these are THEIR descriptions of said courses ).

I think teaching is very noble. But, the truth is ANYONE can teach - if they have the desire. It's a disservice to the general population in America that our culture promotes the idea that only an elite few are able to teach others. Simply not true. I know far too many examples of the opposite occurring. In some of those examples of people learning from those without teaching certificates and specific teaching degrees we find some very interesting people such as Thomas Edison, Alexander Graham Bell, the Wright brothers, Claude Monet, Abraham Lincoln, and a considerably long list of other influential people in the last hundred years including presidents, artists, Constitutional Convention delegates, religious leaders, writers, Supreme Court justices, and even university presidents. But, there are so very many "average" everyday people who teach as well - and not just their own children. There are homeschool co-ops across the country where parents take turns teaching the combined children of a number of families at once.

There are some skills that require a person highly trained in that specific skill to teach others. Medicine is probably the best example given the subject matter of this board. Only one who has been specifically trained in current medical knowledge and practice can really pass that on to others. But, what I am talking about is basic, fundamental knowledge that all capable human beings should learn. All willing adults are capable of passing on this knowledge. Teaching in and of itself is not something only a few can do. It is true that some possess knowledge outside of the general population that only they can pass on to those desiring that highly specific, detailed knowledge. But, in matters of a common education, any and all may consider themselves teachers - if they are so willing.

Jennifer

Luanne, That would be awesome if you could visit your daughter! I've never been myself, but have heard that Scotland is an amazing country. You must be so proud of her!! It makes the college tuition bills worth it!

Erica

[fluffhead]

Hey Luanne,
(I like this concurrent tourism/education thread)
Scotland is wonderful to visit. Just hope for sunny weather. And bring back some Islay single malt for me!
I had amazing weather when I was there, and got some great hiking/camping in. Make sure you get to Arran and Skye islands.
and Edinburgh.
Hope you guys make it there.
We now return you to the teacher licensing debate, already in progress.

(I'm an unlicensed teacher, with no desire to teach in the public school system)

[mommax3]

Fluff,

We now return you to the teacher licensing debate, already in progress.

You crack me up!

Sally

There's a good article on the front page of today's Wall Street Journal about the Singapore math that Jennifer mentioned. It looks like some school districts in Massachusetts (not Boston) are experimenting with it, with positive results. The article also mentions a couple reasons it's difficult to implement-- teachers have to work a lot harder to teach it (they can't just flip to the answers in the back) and parents sometimes get frustrated because they don't understand what their kids are doing. Also, because it favors depth of learning over breadth, it leaves kids less prepared for US standardized tests. To me, this is further evidence that education needs to be changed on a national level.

Tomorrow, Boston College will release another 4 year study about how behind we are compared to Asia.

[PrincessFiona]

Interesting thread....I would have to agree that when sending my children to school I want their teachers to be certified. At the same time, I also recognize that certification doesn't necessarily mean that the teacher will be any good...unfortunately! I have to say that I also have no academic background in education and that I have been able to slowly learn how to teach over the last few years. Private schools do have different certification requirements and some simply require you to have a degree in the field that you are going to teach...that's acceptable to me. Homeschooling parents in MN who don't have a college degree have to pass different standards than those who do...their children are monitored through diff. testing methods to insure that they are getting all of their needs met.....

The problem in general that I have with education classes is that many of them seem to be waste-your-time and money classes. There is a value in teaching teachers how to teach, but many classes that you need for the 'certification' are just filler classes. The really valuable experience probaby comes with internship.

There are people who have a natural gift for being able to teach things...I would say that I probably don't have this gift....at least..I'm not the kind of teacher that can just stand up and speak on any topic with no notice. I need to plan and practice

I have met people that do seem to just have a gift for being able to innately KNOW how to teach something...it's amazing to watch.

my teaching experience

Having taught for over 7 years, this topic is quite personal and there are so many sides to consider in this issue. I'm not sure where to start...

I think when it comes to our children’s success in schools; teachers do take the ultimate responsibility. I believe to become a good teacher you should continue to take classes that relate to your teaching style. Like all professionals, you should have a certification to teach. However, I have to honestly say that many of the classes I took to get my certification were BS and had nothing to do with my ability to teach. I believe that a multiple choice test (I have taken 6 these tests) cannot show whether or not you are a good teacher, especially ones that are teaching primary grades. I agree with Kris that teaching is an innate talent and it is something that can best rated by observation instead of testing. I think that why the NEA is so against them. I have known excellent teachers (who have been teaching for many years) who do not pass these test simply because they have not taken tests for so long. I see it like a doctor having to take the MCAT again after years of being an attending.

I am not saying that there are many unqualified teachers out there... believe me I have seen my share and could tell you horror stories. These teachers however could easily take a test or a few online classes and continue teaching.

As far as public schools vs private or Montessori schools, I believe the major difference is the funding and the involvement of parents. I worked in a Montessori school before I got my teaching credential teaching a class of pre-kindergarteners. By the end of the year, many of them were reading or ready to read and they knew how to add and subtract. There were less than 20 students with 3 adults in the classroom. I also had these kids from 7 in the morning till 5pm. There was much time for us to do many activities and work one on one or with small groups. Parents were involved in everything their children did.

When I went to teach in the public schools (Los Angeles) I was shocked that many of my kindergarteners did not know their ABCs or could not count to 10!!! They came from poor families and many parents were unable to spend any time with their kids. I had 20 in a classroom with only an aide for 1 hour. Furthermore, these kindergarteners were only with me for 3 hours a day. How much could I teach them to get them ready for first grade? The sad thing is, these kids barely get any art, music or playtime because we teachers are mandated to have them reading and writing by the end of the year. These pressures are on because by the time they are in first grade they are given standardized tests. I cannot tell you how upsetting it is to spend many days teaching 6 year olds to bubble in answers while they cry from frustration. I have to say my students did very well but in comparison to students who have a base, there is only so much you can do.

Students do better when they have a strong base. Unfortunately by the time they start kinder it is too late for many of our students. Compared to those who have gone to preschool or whose parents have been involved they are already left behind. We need more programs like headstart available everywhere to help our education system.

We need more funding in schools period. I don't think raising teacher salary is necessarily going to help. Not that I wouldn't love that. The same political BS is going to exist and we'd just get blamed even more. What we need is more books, more computers, more supplies and more help!
I can continue ranting for days…I better stop for now

[PrincessFiona]

Cherry,

Great post!

Kris