I need a hand

[PrincessFiona]

Things are out of control financially in our house and I' experiencing something I've never before experienced with dh.

We had a tough year last year after committing to a cabin. The cabin followed an exceptionally good year, btw. We saw/see it as an investment. It has already gone up an estimated $12k since we bought it.

Last year though, things were just not that great. We also were dragged down by the second mortgage payment .... we took a huge hit in healthcare costs because of the kids and had some other surprising expenses. It sucked.

We went into some debt before things finally turned around....but we are back to having a car payment for me because my car broke down for good. Our financial cushion basically disappeared.

So anyway .... we went from being fairly comfortable, responsible and happy about where we were at financially to being on edge ... and we've been that way all year. It sucks. We haven't been in this place since the first year after fellowship ended. (I feel bad even saying this because I feel like you are all the perfect saving/couponing/spending machines. This makes me feel like a failure.)

We have continued with our contribution though to retirement, etc and are doing well with putting money away for the future. It's just the present that is taking a hit.

We could not afford to send Andrew to the dorms in the Fall and can't send him in the Spring either. We're tapped out just paying tuition for both Andrew and Amanda.

I can't mention anything about finances or Thomas freaks out. It's rare to see him so stressed.

So ... Christmas is coming. Christmas means gifts for everyone. He basically told me each kid was getting a single, inexpensive gift that he would pick out. Ummm. okay.

I wasn't allowed to Christmas shop for anyone but Zoe. DH did all of the shopping.....interestingly, when he hit submit this morning on his amazon shopping cart, it had $700 in it. Mmmhmmm. If I had spent that, he would have flipped out. He was okay with spending it seeing as he was in control of it.

It kind of irked me that I couldn't spend it though but he could.

Oh well .... at least everyone gets gifts.

The next issue is the kids' college. No dorm for Andrew and he is wild over it. He is planning on applying last minute for financial aid. We'll see what happens.

Both Andrew and Amanda are talking about the dorms for the Fall. Amanda even wants to go to a community college far away with dorms for a better experience. Thomas will not hear of it.

He has revised his ideas and believes both kids should be happy living at home for their entire college experience. Period. He doesn't even listen if I bring up anything about the benefits of dorm living. He doesn't care. He used to.

Thing is, he talked to a financial advisor who told him to double down on what we are putting away in retirement. This guy basically told him not to pay for our kids colleges and to pay only for us....and now Thomas is rethinking having 5 kids and paying for their college. As it is, we have a pretty good sum of money in retirement. It would be better if we hadn't lost some when the market tanked, but we are pretty good. We are saving what our first financial advisor advised us to save....

How to I get through to dh ... and survive this. We can't suddenly change what we agreed on with the kids. I believe the kids deserve the chance in the dorms. I'm sort of beside myself. This is a good financial year, and we will reap the benefits when we get a settle up in July.

I hate that I don't work and contribute financially. I have been looking every day for jobs that would give me experience in my field and offer a paycheck, but everything interferes with kids' schedules. It's ridiculously difficult. I just want an income of some sort so that I can contribute to the decision-making processes, but there is no job I could take that would help me pay for dorms or anything else. Quick ... tell everyone you know to buy my book. Just kidding. Ugh. I need some clearer heads to talk me down.

Kris

[alison]

It's financial doomsday for us, too. The panic of it makes you do irrational things like put $700 worth of things in an amazon cart. We're one emergency away from draining our emergency fund completely (as I type this, we have cut off electricity to our garage because it's leaking like crazy and rusting out the outlets). For all intents and purposes, it's an emergency that we'll have to do 10k of work to, but can't afford for the time being. It sucks.

We aren't doing presents this year, but I think if our kids were older or we had more kids, we'd each just draw a name and everyone would give one other person a gift.

Today's our 10-year anniversary, and we're not doing anything for it.

Hang in there. The holidays always exacerbate money woes, I think.

[PrincessFiona]

(((Hugs))) The holidays do exacerbate things because there is the expectation of giving, giving, giving to family and extended family.

I keep trying to reign it all in with perspective, but right now he's not hearing it.

[alison]

Aw, now you're giving ME hugs, when my intention was to comiserate and try to make you feel like you're not alone. In the end, we (you and I both) will be fine. It gets uncomfortably close to the bottom of the piggy bank, but I'm sure you'll bounce back!

[ladymoreta]

Big hugs, Kris. Someday I'll confess to some of the stupid things we've done with money, but not yet...

My best advice is put the cabin on the market right now. Hopefully you'll make a little, but even if you lose some, it will free up so much of your budget. It doesn't have to mean the end of your dream to retire there, but it's totally fine to rent for vacations right now. It is beautiful, and I know it's such a wonderful place to spend family time, but I think it's the biggest single thing you can do to ease the stress that is coming between you and T.

[diggitydot]

I need a hand

First and foremost, staaaaaaaahp with the comparisons. Particularly where money is concerned. Just because people *look* like they have their shit together doesn't mean they actually have their shit together.

Thomas goes into full control freak mode when he feels like things are almost the tiniest bit not going according to plan. That's his shit to fix. You can't fix it for him. And he won't fix it until he realizes just how incredibly unhealthy and hurtful that reaction can be for him and everyone in the family. The only thing you can do is help him "discover" a paradigm shift.

I wouldn't recommend putting the cabin on the market. Sure as hell not right now. Besides the fact that you two bought fairly low, not a lot of vacation properties sell in December. It's not going to make an immediate impact, anyway, since it wouldn't even close for at least 30 days after contracts are signed. No sense in stressing out over it right now when there really isn't a damn thing that can be done.

Andrew and Amanda are some pretty amazing kids. They will discover life skills that neither you nor they knew they could learn once they are forced to do so. Living in the dorms is a fabulous way to bridge the learning gap between "kid who can't do shit for themselves" and "fully functional, self-sustaining adult".

I think your and Thomas' desire to pay for their educations is an incredible gift to both Andrew and Amanda. However, I think it's entirely OK for them to seek out financial aid or loans if they want their college experience to be something different than what you two are willing to fund. That is a responsible choice on their part to not just expect mommy and daddy to foot the bill. I think part of allowing them into adulthood is to listen to their desires and let them make some of these choices.

You're both pretty great parents and want the best for your kids. Sometimes it's hard to keep that in mind when our spouses are driving us BSC with their shit.

[Phoebe]

^^^^ I'm with Diggity.

[GrayMatterWife]

^^^^ I'm with Diggity.

Per usual, I also concur with DD.

[BonBon]

^^^^ I'm with Diggity.

Me too. Perfectly said.

And you know what happened with our house, so we clearly don't have our shit together. Everyone has these moments, and you guys will get through this one.

[spotty_dog]

Money stress is so everpresent, and uncertainty about "is there ever enough" and high expenses and seasonal expenses just pile on each other. I'm sorry.

But Kris, I hear you saying that you and Thomas are in a good place relationship-wise...then I see all the stories about him making these one-sided decisions like putting his foot down about choices that affect the family and making you feel like you're not empowered to make decisions about things like the Christmas budget. That is so not cool.

When my DH gets stressed at work, or feels overburdened by his role as the family provider, that's when he starts fretting about retirement and wanting to put every spare penny in savings and nit-picking my spending habits right down to the brand of toilet paper I choose. Is the RVU/bundling thing you posted about elsewhere stressing T out?

Anyway, DD is of course spot-on. I hope you guys put this behind you sooner rather than later. But please work on this "have to get a job and contribute in order to have a say" stuff. I struggle with it too. I spent pretty much the last three years searching Craigslist for job postings each.and.every.time I got PMS, fretting with anxiety kicked up to 11 about how that was the only way to feel like I had worth. But the thing is, assuming you guys plan to stay married until you are old and gray, every money decision affects you both, whether your name is on the paycheck or his is. You're married, and that means you have a say. Period. The fact that having a SAHM makes his life easier and makes your contribution priceless is just the icing on the cake.

Hope you feel better today!

[PrincessFiona]

We actually are in a good place with most things. Up until this year, money was something we also never squabbled about. I don't know what to do really.

The cabin is financially not the issue. We bought low and it's a great boost for us.

The issue started with a bad financial year and 2 kids in college. They go to state schools but it isn't cheap. Let this be a lesson. Pay into college funds during residency/fellowship!

From where I sit, things have normalized again financially. We are on track again. He just can't get past last year. Honestly, it was rough with the unexpected costs.

Anyway, my issue is not being on the same page and helping him get past the anxiety. Our marriage is still good even with this disagreement. I am just trying to get us past this ... and I'm bummed I don't contribute financially, but even dh says I'm irreplaceable. No money would be worth my absence for a job.

Btw, I think the rvu bundling is stressing him out. Things look good for us so far for the year but every day he frets over what will happen. Funny that it isn't on anyone else's radar around here ? We draw 80% of his income and get the other 20% plus at the end of July. That's college money .

Sorry for the phone post.

[metroguy]

my advice-- fire the financial advisor - and goto boglehead.org - 3 funds approach. in theory it should work out better.
another interesting money maker- refinance the carbin--take equity out to pay for the college dorm. between a carbin or the kids' experience, i vote the kids experience.
also, have you thought about signing up to credit card rewards? it's easy and free money. i got 2/3 nights of free hotel rooms. 400 for signing up to chase acct. also got 100 for various gas/food 5% rewards. it's relatively to do and you can do it several times a yr.
of course-- none of these will really make any difference if you're not in sync with your dh.