need some encouragment

My soon to be husband will be going for the match in 2004. I will be leaving my job of a lifetime(great pay, love it, solid future), my country (Can.), my family and friends to go with him to his residency location.

He has basically said that yes he'll discuss the locations with me but it's really his choice for what residencies he chooses. At first it sounded wrong to me, but I do agree. I won't be going on any interview with him so I have no idea what the programs are like and it is him who has to do the program. I really wouldn't have anything to say about them.

Here's the thing. I know you aren't supposed to "count" things in a relationship like I did that, you did this, etc. As you shouldn't have a scorecard. BUT, I just can't help it. I see it as me giving up everything for us, and he has to give up nothing. Which too, I understand, he has no choice at this point.

I guess my main thing here is that, I feel I have no choice in anything right now. There's nothing he can do about it. I can't really help him pick a residency because I will know nothing about them.

I'm feeling like everything is for him and his career and what about me????? Then I try to answer that, and I have no answer. Yes, he should choose the residency spot because know nothing about it. Yes, I have to move there because he can't do residency here.

I guess I don't know what i'm trying to say here but that right now I feel like I am the only one who has to sacrifice for this relationship and i'm feeling a little jilted. Like it isn't fair. But, I don't know what would make me think it was fair.

Your story sounds so much like mine that it scares me. My now husband was in the 2000 match and we ended up in Milwaukee, his third choice on the list. For me, it meant leaving Denver, where I had a thriving career and a great life for over 13 years. I very naively figured I could make a life for myself anywhere, so it didn't matter where we went. But I was wrong. Milwaukee has been a disaster for both of us. He has not been happy with the program at all, and I've watched my career stall out (laid off twice in one year), had trouble making friends, been isolated from the rest of the resident population (his controlling father picked out our house in a remote area 40 minutes from the hospital because it was a "growing area and we'd get return on our investment"--always the Almighty $ with him), and financial and time constraints have meant that I have not been back to Denver even once in three years. I ended up on medication for clinical depression, and gained 60 lbs in a year from the medication. At the moment we're counting the days until we can leave here.

All right--sorry to vent and be so negative, but I'm kind of the 'worst case scenario' and I'm so very glad you're thinking about this before it all gets started, because I didn't. Sometimes there does have to be a "scorecard" of sorts in a relationship, or one of the partners gets left behind, and not always through any conscious thing the other does. What I can advise you to do is talk things over with him from the start. Have him look at programs in communities where you'll be able to find work in your field, and parts of the country where you'll feel comfortable. Ask him to talk with the programs he interviews with about what support they offer to 'trailing spouses'--they usually have something in place. And, if worse comes to worst and you find yourself in my situation, make a deal with him that you'll only be in the place for the time of the residency and will make your next move somewhere you both choose together.

That's what we're doing now. He found a practice in a place that we both think we'll love, and I'm looking at going back to school for my Masters. And his father is NOT invited to help look for houses this time. Insisting (gently) on "what's in it for me" was the best thing I've ever done.

Any time you need to talk--I'd be happy to help in any way I can.

Eliz

I agree. The biggest thing that I read from your post is that you aren't involved in the decision...and you should be! You're partners and although it's his career, it greatly affects you.

I definitely think you should talk to him about it. You said you don't know anything about the programs. Ask your husband about them...try and do research online about the programs and the cities they're in. I don't agree that the residency choices are his alone. You're partners and this decision is a life changing event and so you should be part of the discussion.

That's my two cents...I just know that I always feel better when I'm included in decisions and I have a say rather than being "told" what to do.

Good luck and keep us posted...
Sharon[/quote]

[mommax3]

My husband always appreciates the research I do about communities that we may live in. He doesn't have time to check them out the way I do, so it works well for us. I think that your fiance would be missing out if he didn't keep you informed of the places he was interested in and let you weigh in with your opinion -- not just about jobs for you, but about other quality of life issues, as well. Yes it's "just" residency and won't be forever (thank God!) but it will be a very important time for you two -- the first years of your marriage. He should definitely look places where you have a good shot at finding work in your field. You should be in this together, doing whatever compromising needs to be done so that you both have a shot at happiness where ever you move.

You DO still have choices, you know. Find out all you can about the specialty he has chosen and what he wants in a residency program. Help him determine his priorites. If you can't go to interviews with him, debrief him afterwards. Help him when he ranks the programs. The bottom line is, he doesn't really get to choose the programs -- they choose him.

Be very careful about accepting that his career is everything and yours in nothing -- that doesn't often work well in the long run. A medical career will take and take if boundaries are not established early. Discuss this with him when you can. I am sure that he is concerned about your happiness through all these changes and feels somewhat powerless to control things. Keep communicating -- that is the most important thing.

Let us know how things turn out.

Sally

[SueC]

I think you are totally justified with how you are feeling. If you end up getting dragged to some location that you hate and you had no say in the matter whatsoever, that could definitely cause resentment to build up in the marriage. I think sometimes Doctor's or med students get so caught up with what is best for them and their careers that they forget about the people behind them that keep everything else running while they are at the hospital. Maybe if you sit him down and have a very open discussion with him, you can get him to see your point of view as well.
Good luck!!!

We have talked about it a lot. We will discuss the places he goes for interviews but he has to apply for them all. The bottom line is really that we'll go wherever takes him. He's going for a Radio residency and although he's got great marks, he's an IMG so he may not get in anywhere and we are just praying he'll get in somewhere. After residency is over, we will be deciding where to live and i'll have much more say in it than what I can offer now.

It seems to me though, that his career will always "lead" our direction. That not necessarily his wants but the requirements of the job will take precidense over everything.

Again, I don't want to count anything but I think sometimes you just have to. I love him completely, fully, and want to be with him forever. The way I see it though, I am the only one sacrificing for this relationship as it's his job that we are doing all this for.

How do I live my life with him and not feel jilted or jaded that the coin is always flipped on his side because of his job? Or how do I make it so I feel it's even? Am I missing something, do you feel this way too? How do you ignore the fact that your life is built around someone else's job? I want to stop thinking this way, or not worry about resenting him at some point down the line. I guess I need some ideas because I don't have any of my own, that will make myself content in knowing that he's putting stuff on the line for me also.

[DCJenn]

Well, this is the way that I'm thinking about it- since my entire career will be impact for he rest of my life- my husband is a career Army physician-

There were some really potentially horrible places that we could have been sent if he hadn't been accepted for the fellowship. But, exactly what could I do about it? Absolutely nothing. There comes a time when you have to give up the 'choice' and just make it work wherever you happen to be. The choice is be miserable or not be miserable. I choose not to be miserable- although there are miserable things about each place, if you look at it like that.

Thinking about things like that has made it much easier to know that we're going to be moving every three years for the next 9 or so! (at a minimum)

Jenn

[houseelf]

This one has taken me awhile to gather my thoughts to respond. First, I invite you to read my family's match story. It is on the right hand side of the screen under Match stories and I believed that it is titled "Match Day Disaster." (names have been changed).

Let's just say that we moved to a place that I never wanted to live, where my professional license was invalid, I knew no one but was expected to carve out a life for my 5 month old and myself. I was very, very angry even though we ranked my choice first and his choice second. Fast forward three years, and here we are still for a total of seven years. I'm not going to lie, it hasn't been easy. But everything happens for a reason, so I've come around somewhat.

My hubby is planning on doing a fellowship in a very, very competitive field with few positions available anywhere, so it is not exactly a "buyers' market" when it comes to us choosing where we would like to live. I really do not want to issue ultimatums, but you can bet that I'm VERY adament on my expectations about where we will rank and some other parameters that will happen during fellowship.

I'm cringing as I write this because I know that this sounds horribly negative and witchy when truthfully everything has turned out o.k. so far. But Sally is correct, a medical profession can consume an individual and his/her family, so you absolutely need to set boundaries as soon as possible. I don't mean to come off as controlling, but you need to be equal partners as much as absolutely possible. In many ways, where the physician matches affects the spouse more because the spouse is the one who spends more time in the community and finding a new job, new school etc.. Best of luck with this one.

Kelly

[SueC]

I think originally I was under the impression that your fiancee was deciding completely by himself where he was applying without consideration for your feelings whatsoever. It sounds like you are communicating about it, but ultimately their careers do dictate where you end up in the long run. In our case, we weren't married yet either and for some reason I didn't get involved at all in what he decided. I told him I'd go wherever, but I wasn't settled in my career at all and he wasn't considering any places that I didn't want to live anyway. It is hard not to feel a little resentful when you are left with little choice about such important things as where you relocate. We stayed in the same place he did med school and residency so it wasn't a big deal for us. In our case, my husband really wanted to do a fellowship and I cringed at the thought of 3 more years of training. That completely stood in the way of my desire to be a full-time stay at home mom. I think he did ask my opinion but I was always afraid to tell him how I really felt because I didn't want to appear selfish or money hungry, and I did want him to be happy in his career. So, I told him I would support him either way and here we are in the middle of the first year of fellowship! It isn't too bad, but sometimes I do think how nice it would be if he were done already! So, that is my story, but I am very passive when it comes to helping my husband make career decisions, so I definitely wouldn't suggest doing things like I did. As a side note, my husband is very happy with his decision and it carries over into our happiness as a couple so I do think he made the right decision. Basically, I would try to not let factors that are out of your control consume you.

1Atlantis said:

It seems to me though, that his career will always "lead" our direction. That not necessarily his wants but the requirements of the job will take precidense over everything.

errrrrr.....

please kindly excuse what may seem to be harsh - but

why does this have to be the case?????? There is more to life than a job or a career. I understand that our parters are passionate about medicine but this does not make their needs and goals more important than our own.

I am (was?) passionate about my work too, yet I also tried to cultivate the 'good doctors wife' persona. As a result I gave up my own job including some very hard earned research funding to move to a remote area.

This was the worse thing i could have ever done. I hated the place and now i am having trouble obtaining funding to continue with my research.

Partnerships are a big fat compromise - you say that 'this is not necessarily what he want'. If this is the case then he has to respect your reservations about where you end up and that you have goals and ambitions - and that he, as a loving partner should want to help you acheive.

I am just really really concerned that you will follow him, watch him live his dreams and be consumed by an emptiness. I am in no way saying that you won't make a go of it - not at all, more that you can't live a life of regrets and you need to listen to these concerns that you have.

medicine is a job like anyother - the challenges are different for sure. While it is the be all and end all tohim, he cannot expect you to give up everything for his job.

He wants his cake and eat it too.

This particular issue was one that caused much tension between my parter and I. I eventually made the decision that he had to 'choose' to an extent. I respect his career choice but that has to be mutual. I made the decision to return to the city - he followed me not too long after and returned to neurosurg.

I am not sure how to advise you approach this

except
er
don't put up with any crap?

sometimes a girl has to think of herself

I must sound so selfish......

I am so glad that 1Atlantis brought up this topic. I have been feeling EXACTLY how she has been feeling ... and it has made me a B**** lately. Jay will be matching on January 31, 2003 - so exactly two weeks from tomorrow (Fri.) And this is no exaggeration - but his and my lives have been consumed over the last four months by HIS residency interviews, HIS schedule, HIS career, HIS, HIS, HIS!!!! I bring up something about me and inevitably the conversation returns to medicine. Now Jay is not normally a self-absorbed person, but I guess this Match process has totally gotten to his head. The good thing is that I have gone with him to some interviews, have had some input on where we could live, etc. In fact, we're supposed to discuss his Rank List over the weekend. BUT of course, the final say is HIS.

Like most people who've already responded to this thread, if I were to move with my SO, I would be giving up the close proximity to my family & friends, the professional network I've cultivated thru college & B-School, my job, the fabulous So. California weather, and what else? Gee, that means just about everything important to me. But who's counting, right? I guess what worries me - and Jay alluded to this once - is that when I'm home alone while he's on call (which I'm sure is going to be quite often!) and feeling homesick, I might get very resentful towards him & his career. Sometimes, I already find myself feeling this way.

I wish I had some advice to give on this topic. If I had, then maybe I wouldn't be so ambivalent, so anxious about the Match, the move, etc. I guess I just wanted to chime in with a "Me, too."

rainy_city_girl wrote:

I am just really really concerned that you will follow him, watch him live his dreams and be consumed by an emptiness.

Being a very independent person who is not accustomed to being in my SO's shadow, I worry about this too. I worry about being dragged from state to state in pursuit of the next best training program for HIM. He's already talking fellowship in MN or OH... and he hasn't even matched for residency yet!!!!

rainy_city_girl wrote:

I am not sure how to advise you approach this

except
er
don't put up with any crap?

sometimes a girl has to think of herself

I must sound so selfish......

Not at all! I'm glad you pointed this out. I find myself vacillating on this point, tho. Sometimes, being selfish seems a Catch-22. OK, you get to keep the fabulous job near your home & your family/friends; but you lose the guy because you won't move to be near him and the separation is just too much. On the other hand, you leave everything nearest & dearest behind, to follow him to the ends of the earth in pursuit of his next great opportunity. That doesn't seem right either. ooohhh... what a complicated web we weave....

[JaneDoe]

Although I posted on another thread of a similar topic, I guess I'll throw in my experience as well. (I wish I would have found this website sooner because when I read these posts, I think to myself "yeah . . . . I sooo know what they're talking about", anyway . . . .)

When my husband was going through the match, I guess our agreement was that I could "lobby," but he was the one who "votes". Frankly, all I cared about was that he ranked the program in our home state first and then after that I really didn't care because none of them were close enough to our family. But, I have to say that my husband was very considerate of my feelings and he refused to even apply to programs in states where we I thought we would definitely not be happy living. My husband would say, he has to live with me during his residency so he might as well try match at a program where I could at least me somwhat happy.

But, for us it worked out as best as it could, even though neither of us got our first choice. Keep in mind that although the SOs can rank as they please, in the end they're simply given their "marching orders" and go where they're told to. I had to remind myself of this, as well as the fact that I was aware that this may happen when I chose to marry this guy.

The match process stinks, especially for the us (non-medcial spouses, SOs, etc.). But, I really believe it is not a whole lot of fun for them either. I tried to cope with the match by reminding myself that wherever we end up is only temporary (I HOPE).

"

OK, you get to keep the fabulous job near your home & your family/friends; but you lose the guy because you won't move to be near him and the separation is just too much. On the other hand, you leave everything nearest & dearest behind, to follow him to the ends of the earth in pursuit of his next great opportunity. That doesn't seem right either. ooohhh... what a complicated web we weave...."

Isn't this so true, it's what I'm struggling with now. My bf is interviewing for residency and doesn't have many choices. I am also going to be applying to medical school for the fall of 2004. How will I ever choose IF I get accepted somewhere halfway across the country from the person I want to be with for the rest of my life!!!!? I truly believe that I need BOTH a great guy and career that I love to be happy. What a terribly "random" process this is, all I can say is I hope everything works out. And as many other people mentioned, when it comes down to it, he really doesn't have the last say in where he'll end up. I guess just try to find the good things about places you could eventually end up and keep communicating with your SO.

"

OK, you get to keep the fabulous job near your home & your family/friends; but you lose the guy because you won't move to be near him and the separation is just too much. On the other hand, you leave everything nearest & dearest behind, to follow him to the ends of the earth in pursuit of his next great opportunity. That doesn't seem right either. ooohhh... what a complicated web we weave...."

Isn't this so true, it's what I'm struggling with now. My bf is interviewing for residency and doesn't have many choices. I am also going to be applying to medical school for the fall of 2004. How will I ever choose IF I get accepted somewhere halfway across the country from the person I want to be with for the rest of my life!!!!? I truly believe that I need BOTH a great guy and career that I love to be happy. What a terribly "random" process this is, all I can say is I hope everything works out. And as many other people mentioned, when it comes down to it, he really doesn't have the last say in where he'll end up. I guess just try to find the good things about places you could eventually end up and keep communicating with your SO.