changing his career choice

So I don't personally do this, but sometimes I joke with my SO about it, like
"hey did you like your anesthesia, surgery, family practice, radiology, IM, ect. rotations?"
SO- no
Me- are you sure??

He is pretty sure he wants to do Surgery so I am a little scared on how many hours and years he will be putting in compared to other specialties. Do all specialties make you put in a crazy amount of hours/days/years? Or does it just depend on the program you are in?

I have a few friends that have talked their DH out of choosing a certain specialty, I don't want to be like that I want to be supportive of whatever he wants to do, but I am a little scared

[Deebs]

What does he want to go into? I really think there are some people that just REALLY fit certain specialties. DH loved surgery, but he knew he wouldn't survive a surgical intern year without probably getting fired (he had two careers before med school and doesn't always put up with crap well). However, if he had decided he could make it through training, I don't think I could have talked him out of it. I don't know where you are in your relationship, but you might want to sit down and have a serious conversation, as well as make sure he is rotating through specialties during his electives that will expose him to different specialties (when DH was in residency, there were three residents who changed from other specialties into EM because they had no exposure to the Emergency Department until they were Interns and absolutely fell in love with it). Good luck!

[ladymoreta]

Different specialties do have vastly different hour requirements, and that's definitely something to consider when he's choosing a specialty. Not only the number of years, but also how likely they are to comply with the 80 hour "rule". (Hint: Surgery usually doesn't.)

I'm not sure if you'll be able to talk him out of it, but it sounds like you need to have a good discussion about long term goals - when/if you want kids, house, etc., and how that works with a surgery residency. It can definitely work - there are lots of spouses here who can attest to that. But talking about your goals and dreams and how they can work with his is important. You shouldn't have to give up everything while he pursues his dream, and so he should be able to help you work out a solution you're both comfortable with.

[NYCHoosier]

changing his career choice

I have the philosophy that it's better for him to be happy in his career and only be home 15 waking hours a week than miserable and home 40 waking hours/week.
Now if he can be both happy and home a lot, that would be ideal for many, but this is his life. He should choose the specialty he's truly passionate about. I think it's also important not to take it personally if he chooses one that will take him away from home a lot.

[GreyhoundsRUs]

Couldn't have said it better myself, Hoosier

[medpedspouse]

I agree with letting them choose whatever specialty they want. However, (IMHO) this should be a joint discussion because it will impact his personal life...and yours too. For example, if he chooses a specialty where he is rarely home but wants to have kids, yet you don't want to be a "single parent" - there will have to be a compromise. OR say he chooses one of these specialties where he is rarely home but his dream is to live in the country and have all kinds of animals (like one of our friends), must mow your yard with a tractor, kind of place....his wife unhappily ended up doing all of that because he was rarely home. So, something may have to give in his personal life when choosing that type of specialty.

I agree with letting them choose whatever specialty they want. However, (IMHO) this should be a joint discussion because it will impact his personal life...and yours too. For example, if he chooses a specialty where he is rarely home but wants to have kids, yet you don't want to be a "single parent" - there will have to be a compromise. OR say he chooses one of these specialties where he is rarely home but his dream is to live in the country and have all kinds of animals (like one of our friends), must mow your yard with a tractor, kind of place....his wife unhappily ended up doing all of that because he was rarely home. So, something may have to give in his personal life when choosing that type of specialty.

This.

I'm all about wanting my partner's happiness, but it's not okay if it comes at the expense of mine and my children. There has to be a happy medium. It's not as though when discussing (and heartily weighing in on specialty choice) you're saying "You wanted to be a DOCTOR, but I can only be happy if you're an ACCOUNTANT." I've said it on here 100's of times: it's a job. I hope you like your job, it would be great if you LOVED your job, but a job is a means to finance your life -- not the other way around.

[scrub-jay]

I agree with letting them choose whatever specialty they want. However, (IMHO) this should be a joint discussion because it will impact his personal life...and yours too. For example, if he chooses a specialty where he is rarely home but wants to have kids, yet you don't want to be a "single parent" - there will have to be a compromise. OR say he chooses one of these specialties where he is rarely home but his dream is to live in the country and have all kinds of animals (like one of our friends), must mow your yard with a tractor, kind of place....his wife unhappily ended up doing all of that because he was rarely home. So, something may have to give in his personal life when choosing that type of specialty.

I agree with this. DH and I are pretty early on in the process, but we discuss different specialties together. This impacts me, our daughter, and any future kids we have. We consider this a joint decision.

[Flynn]

I agree with letting them choose whatever specialty they want. However, (IMHO) this should be a joint discussion because it will impact his personal life...and yours too. For example, if he chooses a specialty where he is rarely home but wants to have kids, yet you don't want to be a "single parent" - there will have to be a compromise. OR say he chooses one of these specialties where he is rarely home but his dream is to live in the country and have all kinds of animals (like one of our friends), must mow your yard with a tractor, kind of place....his wife unhappily ended up doing all of that because he was rarely home. So, something may have to give in his personal life when choosing that type of specialty.

YES to the above. Any wing of medicine tents to promote "ME ME ME" syndrome. " I am doctor hear me roar" -- kind of crap. The spouse/so most likely is the voice of reason more often than not. I'm all for happiness BUT let's be a bit realistic about the doctors "happy life" at home. If they are never home the SO will do most of the work and if you're okay with that, more power to you. If not, make sure your doc knows that IF he chooses a time consuming specialty he can't have three dogs, a large yard, and more than two kids (as if any of us could afford all that).

This.

I'm all about wanting my partner's happiness, but it's not okay if it comes at the expense of mine and my children. There has to be a happy medium. It's not as though when discussing (and heartily weighing in on specialty choice) you're saying "You wanted to be a DOCTOR, but I can only be happy if you're an ACCOUNTANT." I've said it on here 100's of times: it's a job. I hope you like your job, it would be great if you LOVED your job, but a job is a means to finance your life -- not the other way around.

YES YES YES. Medicine is a JOB folks. It is a means to make money and, honestly, feel really cool while you do it. Is it hard to be a doc? Yes but LOTS of jobs are hard, help people, and pay much less. It's a respected position for good reasons but it is JUST a job with a LOT Of costs upfront in training.


Additionally, working long hours means different things to different people. We did training before text messaging and before EVERYONE had a cell phone (yes I am THAT old) let alone a smart phone. Maybe it's different now but I'm not sure you have a friendship, let alone a marriage if you only see and talk to your spouse for about 30 minutes total in a week and this goes on for years. DH had no access to a computer to email 99% of the time and could rarely call during training. Weekends off were about four times a year.

The hours were okay before we had kids and then the suck factor went way up after that. I LOVE my alone time so pre-kids I was fine. Our kids for the most part don't remember training but there were some moments where crying for Daddy tore my heart out. The good news is we're done with training now and have, by almost anyone's standards, a great life. I am very thankful.

Have a joint discussion where "I really feel like this is my calling" is only one part of the layered discussion. Good luck!

[oceanchild]

I think the things you've heard so far are so good that I don't have a ton to add. But I did want to point out the variation within specialties too. In particular there are a lot of different types of surgery, each with varying degrees of spousal misery. My husband's in peds, and the differences between, say, peds cardiology and general peds are pretty significant.

[diggitydot]

Have a joint discussion where "I really feel like this is my calling" is only one part of the layered discussion.

Precisely.

It's never occurred to me to attempt to dissuade DH from doing whatever it is he feels called to do, probably because he is really good at stepping outside of his own noggin to see how the choices we make about his career impact the dynamic of our home. Only occasionally have I had to, ahem... "forcefully" exert an opinion when he was too wrapped up in his own BS to come up for air. Thankfully, those instances are fairly rare.

For us, it's never been a black-and-white, cut-and-dried type of conversation. It's usually us discussing what we want for our family and then selecting those options that create the existence we see ourselves inhabiting.

[houseelf]

You have received such fantastic advice here! I could cut and paste about a million things just to reiterate, but I'm feelign lazy.

Clearly, we give advice skewed towards the spouse's perspective. Thus, the only new thing I have to add to this thread is what I have often told my husband tell medical students. Basically, my passionately surgical husband advises medical students to choose something OTHER than surgery unless s/he absolutely can not be happy doing anything else at all. He tells them in detail about what all he/I/his family have given up. He even goes so far to advise them to look at some of the surgical subspecialties if the student has to have some sort of procedure based profession. He tells them that he absolutely loves what he does but it comes at a steep price. I would encourage your SO to really quiz practicing surgeons on their perspective. Although your needs are equally compelling to him, let someone else enumerate the reasons why sacrifice will be involved.

[Finding Equanimity]

I like houseelf's suggestion. Interview as many people as possible in each specialty (both of you-- interview the spouse too!) and then make a joint effort that takes into account his passion AND your goals as a couple. But definitely try and get the perspective of people in that specialty now.

[GrayMatterWife]

I definitely helped my DH to conclude that he should pick neurosurgery over neurology. I didn't get into the pros and cons and the "weighing" process. I didn't really have much to add on that account. My contribution was pretty simple: I told him that if he really wanted to do NSG, I was behind him 100%--no crying in baseball. If he wanted it, so did I. I think he really needed to hear that. So many people had strongly discouraged him from going into the subspeciality--he felt sort of unsure and guilty about contemplating it and firmly committing. Had I not felt that way, though, I would have been equally forthright and clear to him. If I didn't want him to do it, I would have said so. He would have deserved to have known my true feelings.

It's kind of weird: people often ask me why I didn't think he should go into neurology. They never ask why I thought he should have gone into NSG. They can only think of reasons NOT to go into NSG. But I had a very clear feeling about why neurosurgery was the right fit for him, and solid reasons, although NSG was not necessarily the obvious one for my particular guy. But no one seems to think that the decision to go into neurosurgery would have been made as clearly as a decision NOT to go into surgery.

Go figure.

[GrayMatterWife]

Unrelatedly, you know what these themed threads always make me think? I am such a bad wife and person. I mean, I miss him when he's not here, but it doesn't kill me. Maybe it's from having extremely low expectations--I thought NSG was going to be SO bad (I thought I would go days on end of never seeing him--the most I've gone is 3, and that was partially my fault, too!)...that it necessarily had to have turned out better than expected. But all these people who want their spouses around more...that seems healthy and normal. What's wrong with me?? ahahahahahaha!--sort of...