The hardest transition

[MAPPLEBUM]

Since it's a pretty unanimous vote here and us still in training are slinking away with our xanex and sauvignon blanc is there any chance you guys could include whether PP/academic and what your spouses' specialty is? And maybe how many miles away you ended up from where you wanted to land. ? Just need to know how deep to cut. (was that too dark?)

I just can't imagine doing this with kids. I can mostly make it just fine on my own but holy cow. You women with kids must be touched by the divine.

[scrub-jay]

We do have some bias here. I've seen ppl over the years who were very active on the boards sort of drop off when things improved with attendinghood and they didn't need a support site anymore. Not in everyone's case, obviously, but let's not completely lose hope either.

[Vanquisher]

Since it's a pretty unanimous vote here and us still in training are slinking away with our xanex and sauvignon blanc is there any chance you guys could include whether PP/academic and what your spouses' specialty is? And maybe how many miles away you ended up from where you wanted to land. ? Just need to know how deep to cut. (was that too dark?)

I just can't imagine doing this with kids. I can mostly make it just fine on my own but holy cow. You women with kids must be touched by the divine.

DH is PP. he will have med students starting in May, but he's private for all intents and purposes. We own(ed) our own practice until (today, tomorrow?). He's going to be hospital employed any minute now.

He is an orthopedic surgeon. He takes call at a no trauma designation hospital about 10 days per month. He probably gets one totally free weekend per month, maybe two, but has the phone 24/7.

Money has been tight owning the practice and we had no steady paycheck. That should be getting a lot better any second now.

We are living exactly where we want to live.

It's truly the hours and priorities. I'm never going to be top billing, and that's just a kick in the crotch. He still works non fucking stop. I'm largely responsible for everything that doesn't involve his job, and I'm even responsible for some of that! I'm just tired. Weary. Tired.

It's in my plan to retire as fucking early as possible.

[WolfpackWife]

We do have some bias here. I've seen ppl over the years who were very active on the boards sort of drop off when things improved with attendinghood and they didn't need a support site anymore. Not in everyone's case, obviously, but let's not completely lose hope either.

Admittedly, I have to hope that plays into it. When I read exceedingly bleak things and completely freak the fuck out to my husband, he has to remind me that this is a very small sample size, and a self-selecting group. And largely surgical. I don't know, but it's a bit of hope I cling to. I have to say, I do know IRL med people who are actually very satisfied with their lives and their marriages. I'm sure as with everything else, everyone's mileage will vary.

[diggitydot]

The hardest transition

The transition from undergrad to med school was by far the toughest for us. No comparison. Training had its shitty moments and attendinghood hasn't been all orgasms and champagne, but both are waaaaaaaay better than med school.

I fucking hated the med school years. We lived in a state we hated, we NEVER saw DH, had no support system, were dirt poor, and I was having a hard time transitioning from working to being at home with the kids. It sucked giant goat balls.

[TulipsAndSunscreen]

I'm also guessing that people don't chime in when things have been better because that's a kick in the teeth when it's not like that for other people.

For us, med school was relatively easy. DH had control of his schedule, his workload was manageable, I was busy with work and we went abroad for a year which was magical. So, I don't chime in to say how great it is when people mention difficulty with the med school years because that's neither kind nor helpful.

[MrsK]

Yes, I see scrub-jay's point. And I'm definitely having an "am I nuts" experience.

DrK is an hospital employed psychiatrist. That's supposed to be a family friendly gig. It appears that there are some problems with both the employer and the employee.

[spotty_dog]

We've had it good all the way along. A lot of factors within and outside our control contributed, so what's the point of sharing?

Transitions were all hard though. Probably the post-training transition was hardest because it lasted longest. Probably a couple of years to get our feet under us and find the new normal. And by that I mean problems like "There's so much money but we still have to budget say WHA?" "We spent three years of residency putting off tough discussions and they didn't magically get easy to have just because residency is over?" But once we were past that, it's been golden.

A tough transition is just that. It doesn't have to mean a lifetime of misery.

[mommax3]

The hardest transition

I will chime in not to discourage anyone, but to provide a different perspective. Med school to (military) residency was by far the hardest transition for us. We moved away from everything we knew to a place hundreds of miles away where we knew no one. We ended up really loving it there, but at first it was me and my 2 year old, with DH at work an average of 100 hours a week. For four years. His program also included away rotations each year that were 7 weeks long. It was brutal, no question about it. Transitioning from that to our military payback years was challenging at times, but his schedule was so much better (although his work environment wasn't) that it was doable. Transitioning from that to actual attending life was not bad at all. Money was tight at first, but that has improved. His schedule as an OB/Gyn in private practice at a community med center is never going to be great, but now if he works more, he also gets paid more, which wasn't the case in residency or during military payback.

As for me, my biggest dream/ambition was always to be a mom, and I have done that. However, I have also worked for the past nine years, and I really believe it has made a huge difference in my attitude about ....everything, I guess. It has been good for me. Having said that, though, I will also say that I think the teaching season of my life is coming to an end. The idea of that used to make me feel anxious ("what will I do?"), but I am starting to care a lot less about that. Now that I can see the empty nest years approaching, I am looking forward to a more relaxed schedule for myself and DH.


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[Pollyanna]

Well y'all know I will have the "glad" perspective a la Pollyanna

I am on board with the transition to attendinghood being the most difficult for us. But, as with all things, this discussion cannot happen in a vacuum.

Our transition involved a big move with 5 kiddos and number six just 5-6 weeks away. Our oldest was transitioning to college, we had one in high school, one in middle school and one entering middle school, and even things were rough for the three year old. Dh had a learning curve at work, my pregnancy was rough followed by some issues with my heart, and we were burning through money faster than they can print it. Seriously. Dh finished fellowship at the end of June, we then had all of July off but didn't get paid until the END of August. So we had two months of two house payments, college payments, three private school tuitions, Visa of course wanted to keep getting paid, Cobra, all the utilities needed to stay on, and of course we had to eat, etc, etc. So to say that was a rough time would be an understatement.

But here is the thing. None of that had to do with medicine. All of it could have happened had Dh been an engineer (because for some reason doctors thing engineers have it so easy). And the move, that was a joint decision. Again, had nothing to do with medicine. We didn't have to move, dh had two job offers in our hometown. Hell, it would have been way easier for me had we stayed put. But in a family of 8, it's not all about one person (that includes the doctor). The move gave dh an amazing opportunity and we truly believe will be better for our children in the long run. All I had to do was tell dh to sign with hometown choice A and he would have done it without flinching.

What made things more manageable for dh and I is that we had been married 20 years going into attendinghood. I know I can count on him to be there anytime I need him and he knows I will only call if I'm really in a bind. There is an understanding of I do my best to make his life possible and he does the same thing for me. We developed that belief early in marriage and that way I don't ever have to worry about my needs being met (of course it's not a perfect system but it is what we strive to do for each other). So for us, having all those years of marriage under our belt has been huge because it has been a constant work in progress. We aren't a couple to let things fester. Well, I won't let things go until they are resolved so that probably helped a bit (I can be a PITA in that regard)

Other interesting note: my mom always used to say that people hit their late thirties or early forties and say, "is this all there is", and then that is when affairs happen (regardless of profession). She is big on prepping her kids for the future and explained that everyone feels like this from time to time and it's okay. So I guess I expect that feeling from time to time and don't get too worked up about it.

This is how our transition played out but there are so many moving parts to life that it hard to compare one life to the next. Everyone has their own peoples in their shoes whether or not you see them. But those of you still training need not despair. This is a doable journey that will take work and commitment from all parties. Sometimes you will be on the same page and sometimes not even in the same book but don't jump off the cliff just yet and don't read these accounts and create a self fulfilling prophesy for your own life.

ETA: What I wish someone had told us at the beginning of med school was to save $20k-$40K for the transition from fellowship to attendinghood. Having done that would have made our life so much easier. So if you're in training try and create a little stash for the transition.

[Sheherezade]

For us, the thing that made it hard was to a place neither of us knew with a very different culture. I had no support system and had to leave friends behind (again). But this time, they weren't easily replaced for years in our new locale. I'm definitely a square peg in a round hole location. It's a hard gig and it takes years to make that work for you emotionally. Bad location seems to be a theme with many people on here at any transition time that they found difficult.

Morals: #1 Don't discount place. It makes a big difference.

#2 For us, we didn't have many job choices and couldn't stay put, so there you go. For us, that was most likely because he is highly specialized academic. In that type of job search, there are good years and bad years. Sometimes, nothing is available where you want it when you graduate. That's just how it is.


Angie

[Pollyanna]

I think Angie is right on about location. Talk about where you'd like to end up all the way through training. But like Angie said, realize you may have ZERO choice. There is not always a job available in the location you think you want. And also realize that just because a location is awesome, it will very rarely make up for a crappy job. The trick is finding a happy medium.

[SoonerTexan]

The hardest transition

So is it the transition to attending hood that really sucks, or attendinghood? I think there is a difference.

I read something recently that said people were no happier with higher income once it hit 70k. We did that last year. I believe it


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[rufflesanddots]

I've read that too, ST! I thought it was scaled to debt level, but could be wrong. Maybe it was $70K per adult?

[Deebs]

For us, it took a long time for DH to find a good fit. He trained at a place where, if something is best for the patient, everyone makes that happen (I mean doctors, techs, administrators, secretaries, everyone). His first job was academic at a place the patients were hardly considered at all and attending a were sleeping with residents like they were on Grey's Anatomy. It was bad. Then, he went to a stop gap to get out of there, and then we headed for the dream job where the practice manager was embezzling and the head partner was going through a really messy divorce. It wasn't until we came to this job that DH and I both figured out what to look for in a job, DH figured out how to transition in, and where to make his demands known. It definitely was the transition, but there was more than one.


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