The Fascination with Ivy Leagues

[SuzySunshine]

I will also add that I had a high school friend that went to Cornell, she was a small town Kansas girl that made good - went on to law school (at our state school) and last I heard was working for a congressman. I also know two other people who went to Cornell that I met later in life, neither were snotty and both were very nice people.

DH's cousin has been accepted to Penn and is in no way a snob. He actually doesn't want to go and only applied because its his mom's alma matter.

Like I said in my original response like any school you're going to find people with their noses in the air. I hope my story didn't offend anyone. Would I love for my kids to be accepted to all of the top schools? Sure, but they can still go where they please.

[DCJenn]

I had a great time and got a great education at a very small private East Coast Liberal Arts college. Not an Ivy (damned near cost as much though!)

I think like all things, there are some who want to go for the prestige and who will then flaunt it all about- and there will be those who want to go because it's where they felt most comfortable or had the right program or whatever. I think it's no coincidence that most of our recent Presidents have been Ivy League grads and it's not coincidence that the VPs have NOT. If you have those kinds of aspirations or are in a profession where who you know can benefit then it will make a difference. I can tell you quite honestly, in my field no one would give a rats ass where you went, although we might think something along the lines of, 'damn, what a waste of money to go to _____ and end up doing this.' Of course, in my 25 years as a working professional I've never met an Ivy League social worker or counselor. That may be coincidental, geographic (hardly ever meet anyone who went anywhere on the East or West Coasts here, anyway) or as is more likely, if you're going to spend 200k for an undergrad degree, you're not likely to take a job changing someone's adult diaper or teaching them to mow lawns.

It's kind of like those people who enter a room and announce what it is that they do for a living- it really only matters to them. At age 44, pretty much where someone went to college is about the last thing I care about- either in real life or for people we're hiring.

Jenn

Wait a minute - since when is Texas part of the "South"? Texas is southwest!

Ms.BS: Was that interviewer at WashU? That totally sounds like someone I know here.

I knew I would get flak for saying Texas is part of the "South" but it is thought of the south by quite a bit of the rest of the country... And I love Texas more than most. Nope, it wasn't WashU, much more "north" in the midwest. And I'm sure you didn't mean anything by it but shortening my "handle" to "Ms. BS" is unsavory, I prefer MRS. BS, thank you very much

[SoonerTexan]

Well, I really didn't mean for it to be a debate about whether or not Ivy Leaguers are jerks (though I can see why my story about "Yale Guy" didn't help)--I was really more interested as to why parents/kids are so obsessed with Ivy Leagues as the key to success. I guess I got an answer there too...

[NYCHoosier]

Well, I really didn't mean for it to be a debate about whether or not Ivy Leaguers are jerks (though I can see why my story about "Yale Guy" didn't help)--I was really more interested as to why parents/kids are so obsessed with Ivy Leagues as the key to success. I guess I got an answer there too...

If it helps, I know a guy who rebelled against his dad by choosing Harvard. His dad wanted him to go to MIT but he wanted to be able to keep up his violin.

[TulipsAndSunscreen]

Well, I really didn't mean for it to be a debate about whether or not Ivy Leaguers are jerks (though I can see why my story about "Yale Guy" didn't help)--I was really more interested as to why parents/kids are so obsessed with Ivy Leagues as the key to success. I guess I got an answer there too...

The same reason parents are competitive about everything else. They want the best for their child and they assume that's it. In reality, the best school for your child is the one that the CHILD likes after a guided decision making process involving the parents. I knew several kids who were MISERABLE because their parents made them attend. They weren't getting any benefit from the Ivy thing, they hated it, in fact.

You can get a great education anywhere if you're willing to work for it. The hardest part about the Ivy League is getting in because of sheer numbers. Once you're there, I'm fairly certain that the academics are the same as any other school. At some schools you may have a larger bottom tier of less prepared students but the top kids at any school could compete with anyone.

Though a great education can be found in many places, if my kids got into an ivy....he'll yeah I would pay the way. That is a huge accomplishment. Those schools have reputations for a reason, they offer irreplaceable educations and connections. While some people from there may let it go to their head, they also worked their asses off to get in and stay in.

Plus if gives you a leg up for life. Two job applicants, all things equal....take the one from an ivy. To me, when I am a parent I want to my kid to have every advantage they can. Whether you like it or not, graduating from an ivy league is and advantage. I would never push them into a school they don't want to go to, I think finding the right fit for that kid is important, but if they decide they wanted it...I would support that for sure.

[DCJenn]

Actually in my world, if we had two recent graduates and all things being equal, we'd likely hire the non-Ivy student because the assumption is that they won't stay.

Jenn

[NYCHoosier]

Actually in my world, if we had two recent graduates and all things being equal, we'd likely hire the non-Ivy student because the assumption is that they won't stay.

Jenn

...even if s/he majored in social work? Presumably one doesn't study social work for the money, so wouldn't the decision on whether or not to stay rest more on how fulfilling the job is? I realize social work jobs are often extremely emotionally exhausting, so fulfilling might not be the best word here... dedication to the field, perhaps? Why would you assume the Ivy grad wouldn't stay?

[DCJenn]

If I were hiring a direct care counseling position, my assumption will be that they will leave for a better paying job because they've just spent 200k to get a degree that pays 35k as a starting salary.

But, in all of my life, I've never met an Ivy League grad with a BSW. or even an MSW.

Jenn

[SuzySunshine]

Actually in my world, if we had two recent graduates and all things being equal, we'd likely hire the non-Ivy student because the assumption is that they won't stay.

Jenn

DH had to battle this a little bit when we wanted to come back to the midwest for residency and I won't be surprised if we also battle it if we try to come back after fellowship. Even though we're from the midwest he had several people who assumed because he had gone to med school on the west coast we were only applying to the midwest as back-ups.

[peggyfromwastate]

Dh never even knew the term "ivy league" until he met me in community college. (gasp- yes community college!). He still is unimpressed. He's a lot more impressed by westpoint and the academy, etc. He was all about not getting in debt and not making his parents pay a dime for his education. And he never had to take student loans- he didn't qualify for financial aid- it was all merit based scholarships.

There is an advantage in an ivy league education, but I think it depends on the field you go into. My bro went to caltech. That was a big advantage. He never had to interview for a job. The firm wanted the caltech name above all else. Doesn't Hirt that bro is a great engineer, but having a top tier educated employee is a boon to any company.

My cousins went ivy league all the way- Columbia for one, and another Princeton then harvard law. Columbia cuz got her phd in some esoteric subject. She doesn't seem to be drawing in debt. Harvard cuz and his wife have substantial debt, but much better earning power bc of the harvard name. Harvard cuz's wife helped support him thru law school w her teaching job- most of their debt is fr the Princeton undergrad years. I think they are both happy with the education track. It works for them. He hopes to be a judge someday- and yes he's been so bold as to even consider SCOTUS.

Anyway to each his own. I'm all about fairness tho, and if one of my kids gets into a top school,and they want to go, I will emotionally support it but I'm giving each child the exact same ( inflation adjusted) amount of $ toward their goal. They can use the superior connections fr a superior name to work their asses off for years to pay dn that debt.

I haven't met many ivy leaguers outside my own family, and Its just not a big deal where dh works. If someones a westpointer- that's of special note. But ivy league? Nah.

[SoonerTexan]

Actually in my world, if we had two recent graduates and all things being equal, we'd likely hire the non-Ivy student because the assumption is that they won't stay.

Actually, my company has this strategy, though more in relation to region rather than ivies. They found that people from outside the region tended to leave after 3-4 years to go back home. When I was an intern, the MIT co-op kind of had to deal with that, even though she was from Texas.

[reciprocity]

Having been involved in the hiring process a few times at my firm there is a definite bias for "top tier" schools, but not strictly Ivy. I haven't ever been in a situation where someone would turn down a Chicago or Stanford grad because they're not technically Ivies.

I think the reason "Ivy" is so often focused on is just because of the ease of having a single cultural point of reference. There are a lot of schools that are better at a lot of things than the Ivies, but it's a whole lot easier and more universally understood to just refer to the Ivy League than it is to say "a top-tier blah blah blah".

Maybe that's just because I'm not an east coast guy, it might be a regional thing?

[oceanchild]

I think law is different from undergrad. The "tiers" definitely matter when it comes to law school.