Profanity

[fluffhead]

Actually, I'm wondering about the larger question (sorry Tara about not sticking to your debate limitations):
People on the street, in stores, in restaurants, and in offices, using language that I don't want my children picking up. And using it in front of my children.

It really ticks me off - do whatever you want on screen, in your house, in private conversation, but have some consideration while in public, I say.

I also get mad when my spouse occasionally lets a word slip in front of the kids. I think it's inappropriate.

Personally, I try to control my speech and typing. But I don't mind reading and hearing it - some of you women are pretty inventive.

[Vanquisher]

Well, I personally don't find curse words to be poor language. I think curse words can be very descriptive and help to convey exactly what I mean. The only words that personally bother me are slang terms for genital anatomy. If you want to use those terms, go for it, it just isn't for me.

Do I use curse words in the presence of other people's children? No. Do I use them in front of my own children? Occasionally. I think there is a time and a place. If it is decided that these forums are not the place, then so be it. I think we are all adults and should be able to handle a few four letter words. Personally, it wouldn't really matter to me much if my children did swear. The only reason I do not allow my children to use these words is that people in society get freaked out by them. I find curse words to be just words, that's all. Just a series of letters.

I don't think that people on this board swear enough to make that huge of a fuss over (with the exception of one thread). I have occasionally done it. Can I refrain in the future? Sure. Do I want to? Not particularly. I do not think posts should have to be labeled, and I do not think kids should be reading these forums. I have a child who can read, and I can stop him from reading things I do not want him to read. The last thing I am concerned about him reading on this website is a swear word.

[rainbabies]

[spotty_dog]

I guess I should be feeling some measure of guilt since I'm the one who started the thread that brought Jenn's more-private musing into the spotlight. But really, it's just not that big a deal, you know?

I do generally find that there are better ways to express myself, in writing and in speech. I don't often use anything stronger than "poo" verbally -- but that just lends greater weight to the times I feel the urge to drop an F-bomb! In Internet communication, where intent is near-impossible to determine anyway, profanity generally lends a whole new dimension of interpretation, as it will invoke in the recipient an emotional response proportional to that person's individual tolerance for racy language. So that's a good reason to avoid it if you just wanna get along.

But y'know, it happens. You can't control others' more colorful expressions in public. And I don't feel it's appropriate to slap a censor on the Internets. I understand the parents' concerns for their children, and I don't have any easy solutions, I just think that attempting to control other adults is probably a pretty ineffective way to protect your children in the long run.

And anyway, there are just some things that can only be fully expressed with certain language. Some people act like asshats and some situations are clusterf**ks. Whatcha gonna do?

[SueC]

I try not to curse in front of other people's kids (though sometimes I slip), and try to refrain in front of my own kids, but I still do occasionally. I honestly don't think it's a big deal, if I curse in front of my kids, I apologize and remind them that is a grown-up word that they shouldn't repeat. They get it, my 4 and 6 year old do not cuss. I think if they never heard the words, they would be more of a novelty and they might be more tempted to use them.
Regarding on the internet, I don't want to hear the f-bomb dropped left and right, but it certainly doesn't hurt my eyes to read it. Sometimes I think it adds to the humor or the tone of the post that you can't quite capture using words like "shucks", "fudge", and "oh my!".

[mommax3]

I don't think that people on this board swear enough to make that huge of a fuss over (with the exception of one thread).

\

I agree with Heidi, and I have been here a *loooong* time. I don't cuss in my normal everyday conversation, and I hate it when people cuss in front of my kids, too, fluffhead. It really isn't a problem here, and I consider that one thread an anomaly. I wouldn't like to see the f word and all the rest pop up in every post of every thread, but we aren't teenagers here. We can filter what we say AND what we read on our own. I don't think we need to use profanity excessively to make a point, nor do we need to demand that no one *ever* use it.

Just my opinion.

Sally

[Vishenka69]

I see cursing along the same lines of smoking and drinking -- should be limited around children (who shouldn't be exposed until legal), but essentially an adult behavior that can be indulged in at will. Parents don't usually smoke or get drunk around their kids, just like they try not to curse around them. But you can limit your kids exposure to both in public only so much. Same with cursing. Don't see any harm, as long as I'm in adult conversation with another adult. Kids will learn curses at some point and we'd all like to prolong that but we all learned them, so they're bound to.

[Sheherezade]

I tend to go by the "words are words" philosophy. That said, my kids know that swear/curse words are not polite behavior. I have also told them that it makes you sound uneducated. Adults sometimes use them, but most adults have learned to use them in appropriate settings. Dad curses in the garage when he drops something, but he'd *never* do so in a job interview or around his great aunt.

I think our culture has gotten a lot less sensitive to other's feelings. This comes out in many, many ways beyond cursing in public. I sometimes think this is at odds with PC-behavior, but I suppose it could also be argued that PC behavior is just an "easy" way out. It' doesn't require *really* caring about others....you just follow the rules and go about your business.

As for profanity on the site, I hadn't noticed it was rampant. I had to search out the thread in question and missed Jenn's colorful post. Bummer. Swearing does seem to show emotion in a fairly cold medium. I always feel like an argument is more emotional for someone when they pull out the "sailor's language". That can be both good and bad. I don't think we should sterilize the site because of children viewing posts. I doubt that happens that often. Most kids wouldn't be that excited to read most of this, would they? Maybe we could put a warning *explicit* on a thread subject line if we intend to go that way.

[DCJenn]

Actually the sociologist in me has been fascinated to see how all of this has gone.

How did we get here? From a BLOG, people.... and I definitely don't want your kids or your husbands/wives reading my blogs, OK?

A musing on three 'words'- and it's turned in to a bizarre torrent of other people's issues.

Here's my take: Do I swear? Yes. A lot? More in writing than in person. Do I curse in front of other people? Not unless I know them.

and for when it's OK here? I personally think this is an adult forum for adult issues. I think we discuss all kinds of topics that are inappropriate for children, some of the more interesting have been: the abortion debate, death and dying, drug use, cheating spouses, illegal immigration, violence against women, religion, etc... All very hot-button topics to my mind. and certainly more hot button than whether a curse word is a curse word and where it belongs. I would think that middle school age children would be a heck of a lot more upset reading about someone's spouse cheating on them or the dying words or sick parent's etc.

We're all adults. This is a semi-private place to come and think and vent.
In fact, some of our curse free vents have been more offensive than the ONE thread we had.

Yikes. There are so many more things in this world to get worked up about.

But that's just me, and my drinking, ex-smoking, cursing, liberal, Bush-hating, cyncial, sarcastic, white, middle-class, city-dwelling self.

Jenn

and PS- the man w/ the greatest cursing turn of phrases- Henry Rollins. His spoken word tours are AWESOME. and he's totally hot. Of course, I like Black Flag's music, too.

Let's just pretend I wrote what Angie wrote - 'cause that is how I feel about it.

[pstone]

I can't believe that I am actually going to get involved with this thread but what comes to my mind is that life is meaningless and humans are meaning making machines. Ascribe whatever meaning you want to language, be offended or not, use dirty vulgar words or say "fudge" when you are thinking fuck because none of it matters unless you think it does.

Really, if you say "oh Fudge" I and everyone else in the world translates it in thier head. In many ways it is less expressive, less proper use of language. That being said do I cuss with my wife, of course. Do I cuss in front of my 15month old, yes (I would at this point love for him to say anything, even if it is a cuss word.) Do I cuss in public, in front of children? Of course not!

Do I cuss like one of the poor maligned sailors we keep talking about? No. Do I think there are most of the time better and more expressive ways to say things? Yes.

All that being said, there are way to many vulgar, dirty, shameful things in this world to worry about then people using a curse word on this board. You don't even need words when you can draw pictures of someones "god" and cause riots around the world.

[DCJenn]

Want to know what really offends me?

I did a survey in Northern California. It was a group home for six individuals with severe and profound levels of retardation (a method of classification, not an insult to their personhood)

Client #1 was a non-verbal woman who was blind. She also had a prolapsed rectum. The house was equipped with NOTHING to assist her in her daily living. Why? Well, basically the provider stated that she was too retarded to learn. However, she wasn't so disabled that she couldn't handle the prolapsed rectum BY HERSELF. and after she fixed herself back up- they allowed her to trail the walls. With her fingers. think about it.

Client #2 was an older woman who according to history, had been able to complete all of her activities of daily living. Until she moved in with these people. When we found her, she was double diapered and hadn't been changed in hours.

Client #3 was Hep positive and was walking around with a leaking depends- yes, shirt and pants were covered.

Clients #4 and #5 shared a bedroom that had no light fixtures, just chicken wire over a ceiling light. Not that either of them had any behavioral issues that would allow for the restriction. Further, they both slept on twin beds that had rotted through from the years of urine. but the provider didn't bother to work with them to use the bathroom. Because they were too retarded to learn.

The bathroom was so disgusting that we waited and used the 7-11 bathroom because it was CLEANER.

and it went on and on and on. for three days my co-worker and I stayed at this place, fearful that when we did leave to go fumigate at the hotel, one of them would be dead by the following morning.

and sadly, this wasn't the only place in the US that treated people like this- it was just the smallest one I'd dealt with.

So, no, curse words are just words.

Jenn

and yes, while I really wanted to tell the administrator of that facility what I thought about her as I was walking around pointing at things, "Is that feces? How about there? do you smell the urine? Is that feces? What do you think that is", I remained extremely professional. When I got in the car with my co-worker- we both let it all hang out.

I like it when she adds Maude. As in Good Gravy, Maude.

PS- the man w/ the greatest cursing turn of phrases- Henry Rollins. His spoken word tours are AWESOME. and he's totally hot. Of course, I like Black Flag's music, too

Babe, were we separated at birth? Ever watch his movie review show on IFC?Sigh.

[Michele]

When I saw this thread, really only 7 words came to mind....and I believe they were clearly spelled out by a court of law. :>