Doctor or not?

Absolutely, Kris! I think that exchange says more about the MD who said it rather than the DO.

[DCJenn]

Matt's wife is a DO, I think.

The Army uses DOs and MDs interchanagably for pediatrics. One of our very good friends is a DO and she's an excellent physician. and gives perhaps the greatest backrubs EVER.

Jenn

[Momo]

One of DH's good friends from his cardiology fellowship days was a DO. DH often said if we hadn't moved he would have, approached R about going into practice together, because he was a great guy & "and damn good cardilogist!"
The GYN that I was referred to is a DO, and she is hard to get into(6 mos wait list). My OB (an MD) referred me to her and said that she and many others in her field go to her...I always like finding out where my docotrs go to for their care!

[GrayMatterWife]

We have a friend who is a DO and he is a pediatric neurosurgeon. That's the only one I know personally.

In terms of NSG: it is rare for a NSG to have a DO rather than an MD. And almost unheard of at an academic institution. But, there are some. And DOs have to go through all the same NSG residency hell as the MDs. Everyone who finishes the residency has the same qualifications.

No intent to hurt anyone's feelings, but the reality is that, in general, DO programs have lower entrance board score averages. In addition, most folks, if they had their choice and planned to pursue an academic practice or otherwise practice at a highly esteemed institution, all other things being equal, probaby would pick to attend an MD program over a DO program. Regardless of whether the belief is warranted, MD programs are considered more prestigous, and MD institutions generally have more opportunities for basic science research. This bleeds over into the residency interviewing and match process. However, if a DO candidate rocked the boards hard and had some good research experience (especially with some solid publications), I am sure he'd get NSG interviews.

Please note that I thew in an "in general" and other qualifiers. I do not presume to make sweeping, always-applicable characterizations. These are just the very commonly and generally held thoughts, as I understand them. I am not speaking to their validity--just to their existence and some prejudices or influences that may result from them.

And, on an antecdotal note, like some other folks who have posted, I have be attended by some professionally and personally great DOs.

Wow, this is really intriguing. So osteopaths in the US work in hospitals, prescribe medication, and can even enter specialties such as pediatric neurology and ob/gyn?! I never knew this. I could have made quite an unknowing gaffe... It's as if I was learning that homeopaths could conduct surgery. (No offence intended to homeopaths.)

I had been reading Dr Mercola's site, thinking some of it was interesting, but that most of it was against the establishment. It then occurred to me to check his credentials. When I saw that his qualifications were all "alternative", until the last one, where he was suddenly a qualified "physician and surgeon", I wondered what was going on, and whether he could be trusted to present accurate health information. (For example, I noticed his comments on certain contraceptive techniques were inaccurate.) But in fact, you're all saying that osteopaths do essentially the same university degree as doctors? Interesting.

(Just a note - I hope noone takes offence from this post! A "doctor" in Australia is someone who has completed their MBBS - Bachelor of Medicine and Bachelor of Surgery - degrees and has received accreditation and registration through central organisations. We don't use the term "MD", although obviously it is understood. An osteopath studies a shorter and unrelated degree in Osteopathy.)

Wow, I have been following this all day and am suprised by the opinion of DOs. They are not second class citizens and I feel that it is unfair to categorize them with non-US trained physicians. Would it suprise you that a DO is the head of a level 1 trauma center in a large city? Or perhaps the trauma surgeon that is the chief of staff of this large hospital is also a DO? It's not like they are any different than other physicians. They do the same residencies as the MDs, and some actually do an extra year depending on the state they live in.

DH had scores that got him into both DO and MD schools but chose a school that was close to his dying mother. It was a DO school. He was ranked high at a top MD program for residency and matched at a DO residency. We chose the DO program. It was a year longer but allowed him to practice in certain states post grad.

Sorry if I sound pissed. It gets old defending the DO decision.

[DCJenn]

Sorry if I sound pissed. It gets old defending the DO decision.

You shouldn't have to defend the DO decision. I think there is always going to be bias and assumptions made that aren't fair.

It's kind of like the FMGs- a few bad eggs taint the whole bunch.

I mean the worst doctor I ever saw was a US born and bred MD.

Jenn

Trisha, I hope you aren't feeling upset at any of my comments - I'm coming at this from someone completely outside the US medical establishment, and had never even heard of a DO until I read the Mercola website. I'm learning a lot from this discussion, which I hope will simply remain academic!

The registering bodies here seem to keep allopathic and "alternative" therapies strictly separate, so there is no equivalent to a DO here. You can have free medical treatment at any public (allopathic) hospital, but to be covered for osteopathic treatment (which seems to be limited to what the practitioner can do with their own two hands!) one must have private health insurance and visit an osteopath at a private clinic.

[peggyfromwastate]

They do the same residencies as the MDs, and some actually do an extra year depending on the state they live in.

I knew that they did the same residencies as MDs, but I didn't know that DOs have their own residency programs?

DH would have done DO school (or tried) if he hadn't been accepted to MD school. But we were really glad when he got into MD school b/c they are so much less expensive, in general. Now, had he been entering, he would most likely have gone to the new DO school that's starting in our hometown, and taken the HSPS scholarship to pay for it. So we're not "MD snobs", and personally I'm glad that there are DOs out there, along with nurse practitioners, and MDs of all stripes.

I just didn't think much of the DO doc I had- I've certainly had low opinions of MD docs I've had in the past too. I'm an equal opportunity complainer.

Sorry if I sound pissed. It gets old defending the DO decision.

I understand you taking the defensive, and unfortunately I think you always will have to deal with this, but read closer and there seems to be a lot of support for DOs here. As several have said, just because MD comes after a doctor's name doesn't make him or her a good doctor. And post-residency a DO has the same training as an MD. You know what your DH is and he certainly does. You really don't have to explain that to anyone.

[peggyfromwastate]

Sorry if I sound pissed. It gets old defending the DO decision.

I understand you taking the defensive, and unfortunately I think you always will have to deal with this, but read closer and there seems to be a lot of support for DOs here. As several have said, just because MD comes after a doctor's name doesn't make him or her a good doctor. And post-residency a DO has the same training as an MD. You know what your DH is and he certainly does. You really don't have to explain that to anyone.

(and looking for this ditto emoticon, I saw:

which I wasn't going to post, specifically. I just thought it was funny! Roscablo- I do not think you're stupid! I just thought this had replaced the "ditto" emoticom! Some of these emoticons just never get used, and I'm a sucker for the underdog! )

[Laker]

Sorry if I sound pissed. It gets old defending the DO decision.

I understand you taking the defensive, and unfortunately I think you always will have to deal with this, but read closer and there seems to be a lot of support for DOs here. As several have said, just because MD comes after a doctor's name doesn't make him or her a good doctor. And post-residency a DO has the same training as an MD. You know what your DH is and he certainly does. You really don't have to explain that to anyone.

(and looking for this ditto emoticon, I saw:

which I wasn't going to post, specifically. I just thought it was funny! Roscablo- I do not think you're stupid! I just thought this had replaced the "ditto" emoticom! Some of these emoticons just never get used, and I'm a sucker for the underdog! )

Ditto as well. My comment that DO's are comparable to FMG's was not intended at their education/training. I guess I meant that their road to get into the very competitive MD residencies would be comparable to that of a FMG. There are very successful DOs and FMGs in all medical fields, just that it may be more difficult for them as than it is for an MD to get into competitive MD residencies. I am not bashing DO's education at all as I know that it is equivalent.

OK, now I get it. I checked out the Australian Osteopathic Association website, and found this:

The USA, the birthplace of Osteopathy, is unique in that Osteopath's have full spectrum practice rights. Osteopaths have full medical rights as well as the interest in the structural and manipulative management.
Like their medical colleagues, they have full hospital and prescribing rights and may practice as GP's or specialise in other medical disciplines as well. American Academy of Osteopathy: http://www.academyofosteopathy.org

So osteopathy actally originated in the States, and their position in the US is unique in the world.

This makes me wonder about other allied health professionals, such as chiropractors. Are they called "doctors" in the US as well? And can they prescribe drugs or carry out surgery like osteopaths? Are there other groups that are permitted to do these things too?

It's funny how one just assumes that "the system", being Western medicine, is the same in all Western countries, but it isn't necessarily so.

Chiropractors are called doctors of chiropracty -- or something like that. They often refer to themselves as doctors. I don't think they can prescribe medicine and don't do surgery.

[peggyfromwastate]

Chiropractors can't prescribe, absolutely better not get close to doing surgery.

Lots of people call themselves "doctors" it seems.