And Baby Makes 20!

[scarlett09]

Based upon a brief clip I saw of their appearance on the Today Show, it looks like they thought that Josie was their last. It had been 2 years since their last pregnancy, the biggest gap between kids. She mentioned enjoying her grandchildren during this time between pregnancies. If they want to have more children and is medically able to, then power to her. They can provide for them and give them a loving home. I can't ever envision having that many myself!

I agree with what Chrisada said regarding concern for those who have serious issues that continue to have children. There are some people who just shouldn't be parents. Especially those that I see screaming at and beating on their children at the grocery store for doing absolutely nothing.

Regarding large families, I know that a lot of you have them or are a part of them. My experience with large families has been negative, as my mother was part of one and her and her siblings are all dysfunctional. I'm glad that you all (and the Duggars to a degree) provide an example for me that large families can be loving, kind and peaceful.

[ladymoreta]

I just can't get riled up over this issue for some reason, which is odd because I'm usually quite opinionated. It's not for me, but whatever.

Me too. It just seems like whatever they're doing is working really well, and their kids seem happy and well-adjusted. My first thought was I'm happy for them.

[SoonerTexan]

It's not about giving my younger children over to the older ones to parent as much as it is about my children all learning and understanding responsibility, compassion, and basic life skills. I have absolutely no problem with my older children being involved in the care of my younger children - and often significantly involved in that care. That is the natural dynamic of a large family.

I shouldn't post yet again, but I'm going to anyway. While I think ^^^ can be taken too far (and I admit I don't know exactly what the Duggars set up is), this was a really good thing for our family. We all look out for each other and are pretty close. Same thing in DH's family (he is the oldest of 6). In fact, my youngest sister has probably seen some negative effects from always being "the baby"--though ironically, she'll have a niece to help out with very soon and she's really excited about it!

A few years ago, my parents and DH's parents (we were in college) started thinking about what would happen if both parents died, now that there were children over 18. Both sets of parents decided to set it up so we had full control over their assets and our siblings if something were to happen. That's the way DH and I would want it too--no one knows our families and their needs better than us, even extended family. I know other families would legitimately choose to set this up differently depending on the situation, but I thought it illustrated the point somewhat.

I'm never letting my in-laws and parents get in a car together, though!

[ides]

I wanted to say that I mentioned homeschooling. I'm not against homeschooling but 19 kids of different ages & levels leads me to believe that the education is lacking. That with their ultra religious stance & the fact that the kids only interact with one or two other families in their church & are literally never let out has me question their ability to provide quality education & proper attention.

[niener]

I don't normally hang around the debates threads, but as DH and I are talking about possibly trying to expand our family soon (just to the first one, not the twentieth ) this one interests me. I've really enjoyed hearing everyone's input on this, especially those with first hand experience in larger families.

Growing up as an only child I always looked at big families with envy. Even the dysfunctional ones looked way more fun than my family. To basically have a built-in support network (I know there are bad apples in every family but I'm talking on average here) I think would be such an incredible feeling and so reassuring to know someone's always got your back. But I just can't look at a family of TWENTY and think that looks fun. I think, in a way, being one of twenty would be as lonely as being one of one.

Regarding their decision to have another, I'm in the camp of that's just irresponsible. While they may feel they have an obligation to conceive and deliver every child they can, they also have an obligation to care for the children they've already conceived and delivered. Even with full medical clearance from her doctor, there are inherent risks that come with having a child at 45 regardless of how healthy you are. It's one thing if you're trying to conceive at an older age because you feel your family is not complete, but from what I understand that's not why they're doing it. They're basically doing it because they can and I think that's completely selfish.

Granted I would much rather see her have her 20th than see any crack addict, prostitute, or other equally ill-equipped mother have her 1st.

[TulipsAndSunscreen]

DH is #2 of 6 and he never thought that was weird. He never felt they lacked for anything nor did he feel that he did not get enough attention from his parents. They were homeschooled until high school and again, that didn't seem to impact him negatively, if anything it helped because the schools where his family lives are of very poor quality for the most part.

I know 6 isn't 20 but I think it all depends on what your "normal" is.

[PrincessFiona]

I love you said this.

I would never take the risk. I had crazy post-op bleeding after my third c-section and even though I always thought I would have 4 kids, I decided that I will not take that chance EVER. But that's me. To each their own.

So did I ... nearly had an emergency hysterectomy...thank God I opted for two more!

For me, 20 would be too many. I had always dreamed of having 8...even 12 at one point. I know ... it's good I didn't because I'm pretty tapped out with 5. I'm tapped out, but happy tapped out. I wouldn't have my life be any other way 95% of the time.

It's a vagina, not a clown car? Judgy about people with large families? Think she's a shut-in? Holy shit ... they do more than WE do with other people/families! There is nothing at all wrong with having your older children have some responsibilities with their younger siblings. It builds good character. She has well-behaved, happy (so far) children. I say to each their own ...

[alison]

I think it's crazy. 5 kids, 10 kids, 12 kids---I totally get it. But 20? They're nuts and they know it. They wouldn't have a show, a website, and parade their family around if they didn't know they were viewed by a large part of the population as freakish.

[Ladybug]

It's extreme, but it's kinda Olympian to me. I think only a minisucle percentage of women would be able to carry that many children in a purely physical sense, much less an emotional sense. You would have to homsechool with a family that size. It's logistically incompatible with a public/private education system, so it doesn't strike me as odd, and I'm sure the older sibs help with the teaching too.

I do think extreme stories (athletic training, tragedy/recovery, etc) inspire. I think Michelle has Herculean patience and organization skills. It makes me take a deep breath and think, OK, I can do this with just four.

Did anyone else catch that story about the OK mom that dropped out of college to raise her daugher...went on to have 11(!) kids...opened her own gymnastics gym/academy and now decided to return to havard business school this year (extension program)? I was amazed, fascinated and inspired by her family and life. It was on the today show. I think they live a more mainstream American lifestyle and 11 or 20 kids she would be better pubically received than the duggers.

ETA: And I don't think they inflict some superwoman/mom complex on others either. That is self-inflicted. Just a like an extreme athlete doesn't put internal pressure on me or give me a low-self esteem either, but just might inspire me to go out for that jog around the block today.

Seems a lot of people feel "ok" about their twenty kids since they are well behaved. But, No matter how faith based or "good" the kids are, there is still a point when mommy/ baby health and maternal age will come into play. I think they do a great job with the kids they have, but don't want to see them lose their mom. As other people have said her patience is pretty amazing.

[alison]

What about from the kids' perspective? My dh's cousin is pregnant with their 7th, and the oldest is embarrassed beyond belief because he's ridiculed at school. He has told his parents that he doesn't want any more siblings, and cried when his parents told him about the 7th.

When they go anywhere they have to take two trips or have someone help them with a second car.

And it's a European country where no kids at all is the norm!

[SoonerTexan]

Every year, more than 10 million children in developing countries die before reaching their fifth birthday. Of these deaths, seven million are caused by one or more of five common and eminently preventable conditions: pneumonia, diarrhea, malaria, measles, and malnutrition. To put it bluntly, every day almost 20,000 children die not so much from disease as from callous complacency, killed by conditions that could be prevented or cured with simple, affordable remedies – vaccinations, bednets, food, clean drinking water and antibiotics. ( stolen from Partners in Health website). What does their religion say about this?

I'm not sure what their religion has to do with this?

[ladymoreta]

I'm not sure what their religion has to do with this?

I'm also not sure what you're saying. We can't just go take all those babies away from their parents.

[MissCrabette]

I'm not religious, so I'm probably not the best person to explain this. God isn't telling them to have more babies. They simply choose to have all the babies they conceive. I really don't know how to best explain the difference between that and actively trying to have as many babies as possible, but there IS a difference.

I also wanted to apologize about my crass comment about the clown car before. My intention wasn't to offend, but you've got to admit that it's at least a little bit unusual for a family to have this many kids. If you claim to not even be fazed by this, you're either from a large family yourself, more serene and accepting than Mother Teresa, or you're probably censoring your initial reaction. My point is, we're all judgmental, whether we admit to it or not.

[poky]

I'm also not sure what you're saying. We can't just go take all those babies away from their parents.

No, but a lot of those resources being spent on their 20 children could be used to help those babies in tangible ways instead, maybe?