Babywise

[SoonerTexan]

True, I probably really could and really should let it go...but it comes up so often. And the next time it comes up, I really want to be able to have specific examples from the book that either A. are not backed up by science B. conflict existing widely held child development principles or research. And sadly, so far a good portion of the book seems to fit those two categories. It's not even about it's bad portrayal of attachment parenting--you can get that from lots of places. It is about advice that is just plain false or potentially dangerous.

Because it has come up A LOT. I'm not saying I'm going to go out and hunt people down and shove a doc in their face, but my husband has finally convinced me that people respond best to specific examples with evidence (he's so proud) and I want to be able to go back and reference it very specifically. I care more about the people who ask about it never having heard the background before, desperate, sleep deprived, and convinced that you will damage your child if you don't feed/cuddle/sleep them correctly.

I'm already forgetting what it was like the first two-three months, but I haven't forgotten enough to know that had I not heard about Babywise and the controversy surrounding it beforehand, someone could have handed me the book and in my postpartum craziness, I could have done some scary things that really could have damaged an already rough breastfeeding relationship, among other things. I guess that is what makes me so angry. It actively preys on the fears and emotions of new parents.

[ladymoreta]

She also stresses an Eat-Play-Sleep routine, but it's more flexible. She doesn't seem to set strict time limits on them. She also doesn't recommend cry it out, although she does teach that you should put the baby to sleep alone in their crib. She has a popular method called pick up/put down to calm them. While the routine matches Babywise, I liked her book a lot more because she stresses respect for the baby and trying to learn to distinguish between different cries and meet that need.

[SoonerTexan]

I understood what Tulips meant...it's "correlation not causation" for lack of a better phrase.

I really didn't mean to and don't want to turn this Into a debate about AP though

[ladymoreta]

Because it has come up A LOT.

I think it's this region. It was very popular among my Edmond (OKC suburb) mom friends, and the most sought-after pediatrician in town pushed very similar ideas. For reference, here is his newborn-2 week handout: http://www.mercy.net/sites/default/f...eckup-5510.pdf.

[SoonerTexan]

It was originally a bible based ( well, Gary Ezzos biblical ideas) parenting program so the fact that it might be regional doesn't surprise me

[SoonerTexan]

OMG Laurie! That guy is whacko! Trying to keep your newborn from crying can lead to "irresponsible submission to a deified baby"

There are no words

[diggitydot]

OMG Laurie! That guy is whacko! Trying to keep your newborn from crying can lead to "irresponsible submission to a deified baby"

There are no words

I saw that and was all, "Dude, WTF?" because that shit is all sorts of weird.

[Urowife]

Actually, I find that those principles (non-vaxing, etc.) are very closely intertwined with AP, unfortunately. I find it very difficult to find other people who practice AP and also vaccinate their kids. I have belonged to groups online and IRL, and I never feel like I belong because I'm not that crunchy. And, it really bugs me because AP should be about how you treat your children and respond to them, NOT about being crunchy.

ETA: sorry to be off topic regarding the AP stuff.

[ladymoreta]

Yep, and one of my friends "had to" stop nursing because her baby wasn't nursing fast enough, and he didn't finish in 10 minutes per side. As a newborn. *shudder*

[TulipsAndSunscreen]

And to say that those principles you mentioned are related to AP is insulting to anyone who practices or advocates AP.

I didn't say that.

I said that they are often lumped in with AP and that's why I said "these are not part of the theory but often practiced together". I attachment parent my child and researched it so I know that they are falsely associated with AP.

I am saying that many "hippy-dippy AP, homebirther, non/selectively vaxing, homeschool/unschooling people," that I've met also mistrust physicians. You're absolutely right, there are no absolutes. What I was trying to support was that you have to do what's right for your child/your family. So while I do AP my child, there are elements about AP or frequently associated with AP, that I do not do because they do not fit for us.

I can see, however, why those things are falsely associated with AP because Sears includes information about delayed/selective vaccination in his books and materials (including his website) right alongside his attachment comments. It's easy to see how those things get linked. People think "he's the AP expert so AP must include non-vaxing". It's a correlation that many AP parents also choose not to vaccinate, etc. that was well said, ST!

[Pollyanna]

I think it's this region. It was very popular among my Edmond (OKC suburb) mom friends, and the most sought-after pediatrician in town pushed very similar ideas. For reference, here is his newborn-2 week handout: http://www.mercy.net/sites/default/f...eckup-5510.pdf.

I agree about the regional thing. No one I knew in AZ followed the Babywise program (I'm sure there were, I just didn't know anyone). I actually had never heard of it until my sil, who lives in Stillwater OK, told me about it. She read the book but is far to nurturing to follow that type of parenting style but she knew lots of people who did follow it.

[ladymoreta]

I also have to clarify - no one I knew followed it to the letter. Many did CIO, but they waited until 2-4 months. The ones who were committed to breastfeeding tended to do Eat-Play-Sleep, but added in extra feedings as needed; they just offered a feeding whenever the baby woke up. I don't know anyone who would blindly follow it to the point of failure to thrive (although there were several who gave up breastfeeding because it didn't work with the schedule).

[corn poffi]

Not that I have a dog in this fight, but I just found it interesting that a recent study found that CIO did not lead to negative outcomes. Everybody's different, period, and that includes babies. What works for one doesn't work for all.

[TulipsAndSunscreen]

Not that I have a dog in this fight, but I just found it interesting that a recent study found that CIO did not lead to negative outcomes. Everybody's different, period, and that includes babies. What works for one doesn't work for all.

That study covered only older children and did not do true CIO but the modified version of soothing for shorter intervals, etc Ezzo backs CIO for really young babies!

[corn poffi]

Sorry, I am childless and found it interesting.

***shuffles off into childless darkness***