Pornography: Good or Bad

I wouldn't send my son to have him de-virginized or given sex lessons, not because I'm morally opposed to it, but because it seems creepy.

ITA. Seems creepy b/c it is creepy. And agreeing to be on T.V. through the arrangement of it, and be interviewed after it? More creepy.

Girl #2 better not get the same channel as grasshopper ....

[Vanquisher]

I would have a bigger problem with the nurse than with some chick in a magazine.

I totally agree with this.

In short-

I am morally opposed to porn. I see no real value in it other than if you consider watching the degredation of women and men a benefit and value. I have had two close friends where pornography has destroyed and massacred their marriages to their respective husbands. In one instance the husband turned verbal and emotionally abusive, and was searching out prostitutes on his overseas business meetings. I see absolutely no long term good that comes from viewing or participating in pornography.

I don't have a problem with porn, mainly becuase if DH and I watch it, we only watch it for 5 minutes, tops, because it is so dull. The scenes are positively ludicrous, as some of us wrote above. The danger is when someone views these scenes as real, or what women or men really want. I really can't understand why some people become addicted- porn is really that boring. If someone is addicted or porn destroys their marriage, there must be other issues that that person had. My DH and I laugh at porn, he certainly isn't abusive towards me after watching it. Shoot, it doesn't even get him in the mood, because it is so bad.

DH and I were both virgins when we married at age 26, and he feels so strongly about having unselfish sex, that we don't participate in anything but normal intercourse. But, we watch porn purely for the laughs!!!

[mommax3]

I tend to think along the same lines as Ladybug. With three sons, I am vigilant about our computer.....after learning the hard way that an innocent search on google by an 8 year old (who even spelled the word wrong!) can lead to very bad places. How can I consider the industry benign when they clearly seek to entrap innocent children?

What is depicted in porn is not my idea of a healthy relationship, and I think it does damage to women in ways that are hard for me to articulate, as well as to boys/young men who form unrealistic expectations of women (how they should look, what they should "like") based on what they have seen. I also think it can have a kind of numbing aspect, where what was exciting at first doesn't do it for you anymore, and you need more to get the same effect.

And yeah, if I came home and DH was viewing some action online, I would be PISSED.

Sally

[alison]

I have a serious problem with being objectified. To be reduced to an object to gratify himself with. He better be equally vested in my enjoyment or that would be the beginning or the end for us.

Most porn is about the man satisfying himself and the woman's enjoyment is all based on male ego. Of course she's enjoying it. Who wouldn't? I don't support that.

I see your points, Annie. I'm not saying that I whack my own bottom and scream "shiiiiit!" I objectify and am objectified. It's a two-way street.

[Vishenka69]

I don't really care if he finds other women attractive as long as they're not running through his head while we're having sex. Many of us are drooling over Sylvia's avatars but I think that it pretty much stops there. We don't get into bed with our husbands hoping to find David instead.

But, each marriage is different and what works for us might not work for you and vice versa. I don't think saying all porn is horrible and should never exist is fair. If there was no demand, there wouldn't be this much supply. I may think Birks are the ugliest things on Earth but I wouldn't go as far as outlaw them.

[rainbabies]

Many of us are drooling over Sylvia's avatars but I think that it pretty much stops there. We don't get into bed with our husbands hoping to find David instead.

speak for yourself







:>

[alison]

I'm not saying that I whack my own bottom and scream "shiiiiit!" I objectify and am objectified.

Awwww, come on. As long as your both mutually enjoying it then then by all means....smack it. :wildthing :>

I'll smack his instead!

My DH has occasionally looked at porn. It's infrequent and it's never bothered me.

Me too. I brought it up to him - not w/anger, but curiosity. Why did you go looking for that? What does it give you / do for you? His answers were rather benign, IMO, kind of harkening back to the "immaturity" of the days before he "could" get any from a real person.

I'm the only person he's ever been with. He's not the only person I've ever been with. I tried to keep that in the back of my mind when I was deciding how big of a deal to make of it. I'd rather him looking at a magazine than finding another woman.

Plus, in my serious desperation for him to quit smoking I actually offered to subscribe to Playboy for him if he'd quit. He said he wasn't interested.

I do totally get your points about the objectification of women - how we should "like it" etc., and I think it's totally valid.

[Rapunzel]

In short-

I am morally opposed to porn. I see no real value in it other than if you consider watching the degredation of women and men a benefit and value. I have had two close friends where pornography has destroyed and massacred their marriages to their respective husbands. In one instance the husband turned verbal and emotionally abusive, and was searching out prostitutes on his overseas business meetings. I see absolutely no long term good that comes from viewing or participating in pornography.

As far as the woman who paid to have her son devirginized so that he would go and meet women- I personally would not have done that to my own sons. I see it as a move to devalue sex, which in my mind is a personal act between two people. Dh was a virgin at 24 when we got married and he was not having a hard time meeting women.

From the Fair Queen:

I have to agree with Amiens. I strongly dislike porn and see no value in it. It contributes to men viewing women as sexual objects. I also don't think 98% of the citizens in our country are mature enough to handle it without negative consequences. I particularly hate porn on the net. . .way too accessible. I don't think child porn was *nearly* as prevalent before the net.

I can't stand it when I'm browsing at the bookstore and this guy will start looking at "those" magazines. I am utterly disgusted.

Agree with both of these assessments.

I, too, know of marriages completely destroyed because of the husband's use of pornography.

I want my husband to see me in a sexual light - of course I do. But, I do not want him to see me as an "object" (ie objectify me). I want him to see me as a person - warts and all.

Part of the problem of pornography is that it gives people an unrealistic idea of sex, women, relationships, men, etc. It sets men into a pattern of expectations or ideals that are, well, not real nor realistic.

A healthy sexual relationship is about more than just sex. That is a truth that pornography destroys.

Also, I have a number of relatives and friends who have been subjected to child sexual abuse and/or adult rape. Guess what all of the perpetrators had in common? A healthy love of pornography. It did, indeed, help them to start thinking of other human beings as mere "objects" with which they could fulfill any desire they so chose.

The road to rape and child molestation begins with porn - and supposedly "benign" adult-consenting porn at that. As you have gateway drugs so you have other gateway behaviors.

Plus - why would any woman want her husband thinking about having sex with other women? That's what porn is, after all - a man fantasizing about sex with other women. All it does is desensitize him to the idea of having sex with the woman he meets in person on his trip whom he finds wildly attractive.... The road to infidelity also has a beginning.

[Rapunzel]

Re: social ills

Porn is hardly new news as far as saying it's a reflection of social ills in America. Pornographic illustrations go back to the beginning of recorded history - look at the Kama Sutra, look at the baths in Italy that have pretty x-rated three-ways painted on the walls! Please. Nothing new. People are people, we're here per God's organized religions to procreate, and some people like it freakier than others but everyone likes to think they're not the worst of the pack. TMI AHEAD- scroll if you want to read, I didn't want to offend anyone. <TMI starts here> I dated a guy once with a foot fetish. He was totally against even basic "Spice Channel" (all you see are boobs and the woman moaning) skin flicks, but all he wanted to do was suck my toes. Whatever,buddy! And no, I never kissed him on the mouth! <end of TMI>

I don't know, I don't mind it. I don't care if DH looks at it. As for the objectification and the guy going for his own pleasure instead of mine, when I'm in the thick of things, I'm all about Number 1, baby, and I couldn't care less about anything else! I guess there are all different kinds of sex to me. I think most porn only covers the down and dirty part of that. Most couples however have lovemaking, crazy sex, etc.

As for the impact on teens, I think boys take it any way they can get it. Girls get their ideas on how to look and what to do from everything in media, including the gaunt Nicole Richie, Britney's hoo-ha, Paris and her sister crotch-to-crotch in a limo, etc. That's all on regular celebrity gossip sites, not porn.

I've got to work on a spreadsheet some more and then work out - back later.

Porn is responsible for many social ills - and being "old" doesn't mean it is less so. In fact, all it means is that it has been responsible for many social ills longer. And, humans haven't seemed to learn the lesson.

And, as I stated above (although I was adding to that post at the same time that Lily was posting), the road to infidelity starts with thoughts - thinking about having sex with another woman. And, that is exactly what porn fosters - thinking about sex with people other than your spouse.

As far as the idea that the sex act is entirely selfish - I guess for some it is. I see a healthy sexual relationship between two committed individuals who love each other as about wanting your partner's enjoyment just as much as you want your own (and, your partner feeling the same about you and your enjoyment). I can definitely see a one night stand being all about "Me" and my own enjoyment.

[Rapunzel]

My general reaction is also

This *explosive* market that we see even on iMSN reflects serious ills of our culture. The current porn market is only a reflection of our culture's sexual dogma. It portrays sexual relationships (and I use that term very loosely) that are only about self gratification. Partners are just a means to gratify yourself. This reflects our culture at large, and well beyond sex. I think porn is a grotesque symptom, but not the illness.

I know others will say I'm being Puritanical and a repressed American, but I see a clear line between healthy freaky, fun sex and selfish sex. Married/monagomous couples can definitely have selfish sex. I think the misuse of porn can foster selfish sex...even in a monagomous relationship. It's a very, very slippery slope.

I agree with these sentiments as well.

Although, I *do* believe that porn is both a symptom of something very wrong AND a cause of many ills. In other words, it can be both.

[Rapunzel]

What is depicted in porn is not my idea of a healthy relationship, and I think it does damage to women in ways that are hard for me to articulate, as well as to boys/young men who form unrealistic expectations of women (how they should look, what they should "like") based on what they have seen. I also think it can have a kind of numbing aspect, where what was exciting at first doesn't do it for you anymore, and you need more to get the same effect.

This is exactly how people get into child pornography.

People are not born pedophiles. They are avid pornography watchers/viewers who become numb to progressively more distorted pornography - until the "normal" stuff just doesn't "do it" for them anymore. And, they move downward and downward. And, some end up in uber-violent pornography and some - in child porn. :disappointed:

[Rapunzel]

I don't really care if he finds other women attractive as long as they're not running through his head while we're having sex.

OK, edit: I reread this and should clarify that I'm talking hypothetically here - not necessarily directed at Vishenka - but at the idea that it's OK for your husband to fantasize about sex with other women.... Sorry for any confusion!!! I don't have a problem with thinking someone is attractive - it's the idea of wanting to see them naked and have sex with them that bothers me.

Well, how would you know they aren't? If he wants to have sex with them in his head when he's not with you - what's to stop him from blurring the lines and start thinking about them when he is with you? Why even think about having sex with someone else? If you are in a satisfied, loving sexual relationship why would you even want to have sex with another person?

[Rapunzel]

I'm all about Number 1, baby, and I couldn't care less about anything else!

Case and point. The explosion of porn is reflecting this pervasive attitude in our society.

I don't think that porn shoud be banned. I dont' think it would change this foundational problem that you just underscored.

But, do you think that porn contributes to this selfishness? Is it not just a tool for selfish behavior? Does it not contribute to society's problems by teaching its viewers to see others as mere objects - less than human?